Jelly Posted January 17, 2015 Share Posted January 17, 2015 OP shamelessly stolen from HildaApproved by yung danny NeverUsed Showcase In which, we discuss offensive and defensive threats in the NU metagame.Song of the Week: Pokemon of the Week: Steelix (Mega)Viability in NU: S Rank - Steelix's versatility makes it easy to fit onto almost any type of team.The ability to beat many Setup Sweepers 1v1 while simultaneously supporting the team and packing quite a punch make this snake a force to be reckoned with. Its combined offensive and defensive prowess make it a crime to not include the Iron Snake in S rank. Sets to use on Steelix: Steelix @ Steelixite Ability: Sturdy EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SpD Adamant Nature - Stealth Rock - Heavy Slam - Earthquake - Toxic This set is my personal favorite Steelix set. Tanking physical hits and being able to retaliate with HEAVY damage is what this set excels at. Toxic helps to wear down things that can "wall" Mega Steelix but can't do much back. (ie. Musharna, Uxie, Tangela) Max Attack and Adamant are used because of the need to hit switchins as hard as possible and to help wear down the opposing team. Steelix @ Steelixite Ability: Sturdy EVs: 252 HP / 56 Def / 200 SpD Impish Nature - Stealth Rock - Heavy Slam - Earthquake - Toxic / Roar This set is a more "Mixed Pivot" rather than the above "Offensive Pivot". It eats neutral hits and the Special Defense investment is enough to avoid the 2HKO from a +1 Lilligant's Hidden Power Fire. Roar is slashed after Toxic because racking up SR and Spikes damage can help Steelix deal with 'mons without solid recovery (Hariyama, Gurdurr, Ferroseed) easier. Steelix @ Steelixite Ability: Sturdy EVs: 76 HP / 252 Atk / 180 Spe Adamant Nature - Heavy Slam - Earthquake - Stone Edge/Roar - Stealth Rock/Fire Fang A faster Steelix can be run with more coverage moves to basically let it choose its counters. This spread outspeeds uninvested Vileplume which usually is a pretty good stop to Steelix. Stone Edge hits Mantine which is becoming more popular because of the rising popularity of MegaCamel. Thunder Fang is a more accurate option in order to hit Matine, but Stone Edge is usually preferred for the added power. Fire Fang hits Ferroseed. Dragon Tail can be used instead of Roar to add a bit more damage when phazing and bypass the rare taunt user in NU.Curselix set was not included because it is rather gimmicky and hard to pull off. Also a very neato core based around Mega Steelix is Vileplume-Hariyama-Megalix: Hariyama @ Assault Vest Ability: Thick Fat EVs: 252 Atk / 128 Def / 128 SpD Adamant Nature - Close Combat - Knock Off - Fake Out - Bullet Punch Vileplume @ Black Sludge Ability: Effect Spore EVs: 224 HP / 252 Def / 32 Spe Bold Nature - Giga Drain - Sludge Bomb - Sleep Powder / Hidden Power Fire - Synthesis Steelix @ Steelixite Ability: Sturdy EVs: 76 HP / 252 Atk / 180 Spe Adamant Nature - Heavy Slam - Earthquake - Stone Edge / Roar - Stealth Rock / Fire Fang This is basically the HariProboPlume of XY with a Steelix instead of moustache-rock-dude. It was one of, if not THE best defensive cores in XY NU. It's based around Steelix being able to take resisted hits and dent whatever is in front of it. Vileplume and Hariyama take Steelix's Fighting and Fire weaknesses very easily and allow Steelix to stay healthy by not forcing it to take unneeded attacks. Threats to this core are Sawk with Ice Punch and Swanna, which isn't all that common so you should be fine if you have a Water/Flying resist. (Lanturn works wonders!!!) These are Megalix's main sets which have been proven successful time and time again on the NeverUsed ladder. Common lures to watch for are Specs Swellow carrying Heat Wave and Focus Sash Jynx with Counter. Not overly common but just be on the lookout for them if they try to switch into you :]. Good teammates for Steelix are things that can sponge up Fire/Fighting/Water attacks aimed at Steelix. Setup Sweepers that enjoy Steelix's impeccable wallbreaking ability are also great teammates.I hope everyone learned a little from the very first "NU Showcase"!! Be prepared for a weekly thread breaking down the scariest threats in NU. Leave your comments, discussion, counters, or checks below!-Jelly Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadow Tack Posted January 17, 2015 Share Posted January 17, 2015 The only reason a lilligant wouldn't giga drain/ petal dance on megalix is predictions,so megalix really can't deal with lilligant, a Check i personally would propose is no guard golurk, which dynamic punches it to oblivion along with confusing switchins, most of said switching are weak to another of golurk's moves. Iron fist golurk would EQ and hit vileplume in the above proposed core for neutral damage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jelly Posted January 17, 2015 Author Share Posted January 17, 2015 hp fire from lilligant actually does more than giga drain lol. heavy slam 2hko's regardless of recovery as well. golurk is handled pretty well by hariyama as well with knock off and all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tomas Elliot Posted January 17, 2015 Share Posted January 17, 2015 Ah crap you beat me to this. I wish I could be the one doing these threads for my beloved NU tier, but unfortunately time is something I cannot spare (why must we require money in real life?)... Let's see if there is something constructive I can say: 1) I notice a lack of Curse Megalix in the sample sets. Given that many other Pokemon in the tier can use Stealth Rock, Steelix can be relieved from that duty and given a set consisting of Curse, EQ, Gyro Ball and Dragon Tail, which allows it to set up and hit like a truck while phazing away foes that attempt to set up alongside it (for example Feraligatr might attempt this, banking on the fact that it resists one of Steelix's STABs). And the fact that Steelix is known to be a Stealth Rock user will add to the surprise factor, particularly if you use, as a Stealth Rock user, a Pokemon that is known for having many different sets (for example, seeing Steelix and Uxie in the team preview will keep the opponent guessing as to whether or not yours is a TR team...). Personally, I don't think a Curse set is as good as the standard SR+Heavy Slam one, if nothing else because you trade away the ability to OHKO Mega Camerupt before it can OHKO you, but ehi, it's still a viable set you might want to include for completeness' sake. 2) Totally unrelated, but isn't 252 HP better on AV Hariyama? Then again, I vaguely remember already having an argument with you (or at least I think it was you, but I could be wrong) about the importance (or lack thereof) of HP investiments in Pokemon that need bulk... 3) I am totally requesting Malamar for next (if requesting is permitted that is). I might lend you a hand with that if you want. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jelly Posted January 17, 2015 Author Share Posted January 17, 2015 1) as i said in the bottom of the sets, curse mega lix is too unreliable to pull off. i was trying to focus on sets that could pull of what they needed to do 100% of the time. 2) 128 def on hariyama allows it to live cb sawk (a threat to the core!) close combat while 252 hp does not. 3) eh, i can put malamar higher on the list Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tomas Elliot Posted January 17, 2015 Share Posted January 17, 2015 (edited) 1) as i said in the bottom of the sets, curse mega lix is too unreliable to pull off. lol I can't read. Also exactly what do you mean by "eh"? Edited January 17, 2015 by Tomas Elliot Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Bagel Posted January 17, 2015 Share Posted January 17, 2015 The hariyama in that core is good because first turn camerupt can beat steelix easily out speeding and one hitting it. Another thing to think about is that some people who focus more on steelixes bulk use rest, heavy slam, stealth rocks and....something elts I can;t remember if eq is used or what.As for more threat off the top of my head Specs typlosion is also a threat for steelix as I'm almost sure that one shot kills it with any fire stab usually ran. Rotom and weezing with will o wisp, especially weezing with painsplit can cripple a non rest steelix. Seismitoad just eats this thing and asks for more. Steelix is an amazing pokemon though, heavy slam does indeed hit super hard and it can take almost any non special hit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jelly Posted January 17, 2015 Author Share Posted January 17, 2015 meaning, malamar wasnt too high on my priority list. but with the added buffs in oras i dont see why it couldnt be pushed up in line. e: @bagel, yea defensive rotom and pain split weezing are pretty annoying. but they can be beaten by your choice of teammates! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tomas Elliot Posted January 17, 2015 Share Posted January 17, 2015 @Sir_Bagel I was about to mention Typhlosion as well, as its Specs variant can 3ko Hariyama with Eruption which, paired with Hariyama's lack of recovery, means that the Arm Trust Pokemon can act as a sponge for Eruption only once... But ehi, the one recommended is just a core, not an entire team: it surely has some issues with Typhlo, but a wise player would complement it by adding a Typhlo counter to the mix... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadow Tack Posted January 17, 2015 Share Posted January 17, 2015 (edited) hp fire from lilligant actually does more than giga drain lol. Lies? Edited January 17, 2015 by blasterman4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jelly Posted January 17, 2015 Author Share Posted January 17, 2015 Lies? giga drain has stab and the same type effectiveness..... +1 252 SpA Lilligant Giga Drain vs. 252 HP / 200+ SpD Mega Steelix: 127-151 (35.8 - 42.6%) -- guaranteed 3HKO +1 252 SpA Lilligant Hidden Power Fire vs. 252 HP / 200+ SpD Mega Steelix: 136-162 (38.4 - 45.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO lol at least calc before you go claiming things man. it does do more damage, but i can see why someone would maybe try to attempt to live two heavy slams. (hint: they wont) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Bagel Posted January 17, 2015 Share Posted January 17, 2015 252+ SpA Life Orb Lilligant Hidden Power Fire vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Steelix: 237-281 (66.9 - 79.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery252+ SpA Life Orb Lilligant Giga Drain vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Steelix: 220-261 (62.1 - 73.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recoveryThe difference doesn't mean much but hp fire is betteredit: what jelly said, if using lilli you want to try get steelix to sleep. Otherwise your sweep is over. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickCrash Posted January 18, 2015 Share Posted January 18, 2015 ^ I suppose the HP drained back from those giga drains is not enough to live the second heavy slam. By the way, those sets seem to be quite solid. I tried to check Steelix with some of the pokemon I use. I saw that if you have already lost about 10% from previous encounters, something that's completely natural, you might have problems with Pyroar. 252+ SpA Life Orb Pyroar Flamethrower vs. 252 HP / 200 SpD Steelix: 320-377 (90.3 - 106.4%) -- 43.8% chance to OHKO Evidently Vileplume can't take it. It can 3HKO Hariyama, which is your best bet to counter it. You ought to also have something that counters fire types in general as they seem a bit of an issue. Of course that's half of the team shown there, so you know what to put. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jelly Posted January 18, 2015 Author Share Posted January 18, 2015 i did mention lanturn as something that works well with the core (which is a pretty good check to fire types). hariyama is plenty to counter fire types though. it is 3hko'd by pyroar, true, but it can just blow it away with close combat lol. no team is going to have 2 fire types as well, as every fire type in nu takes 25% from rocks and even more from spikes. (which are very common in nu) having that big of a rocks weakness spells doom even if one has more than one defogger. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raindrop Valkyrie Posted January 19, 2015 Share Posted January 19, 2015 Question, Why Heavy Slam over Gyro Ball? I am pretty new to NU so might have to bare with me. I mean Lix's speed is so low anyway. I am guessing due to better control over the base power or something? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jelly Posted January 19, 2015 Author Share Posted January 19, 2015 it's more consistent due to how heavy steelix is Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raindrop Valkyrie Posted January 19, 2015 Share Posted January 19, 2015 Oh okay thanks lol, was using one on my team and had Gyro Ball mostly since I never used HS before and didn't know if it was any good. I guess that makes perfect sense though lol. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deleted User Posted January 19, 2015 Share Posted January 19, 2015 Gyro Ball does top out at 150 BP, but it requires you to minimize Steelix's speed, has less PP, and with Steelix's weight, Heavy Slam is almost always 120 BP Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chase Posted January 19, 2015 Share Posted January 19, 2015 But Megalix is BAD why do people use this oh my goodn- (I'm just kidding. I don't really understand it's S-rank viability personally, but I do get that Megalix is a very good glue-mon for the tier.) Nice thread, Jelly! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Veterans Azeria Posted January 23, 2015 Veterans Share Posted January 23, 2015 (edited) Megalix is the drill that will pierce the heavens. Also-nice thread Edited January 23, 2015 by AzeryM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickCrash Posted January 24, 2015 Share Posted January 24, 2015 Week 2? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jelly Posted January 24, 2015 Author Share Posted January 24, 2015 it's coming. be patient. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Bagel Posted January 24, 2015 Share Posted January 24, 2015 Jelly needs his sweet time to make the thread all nice and pretty. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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