Tomas Elliot Posted January 21, 2015 Share Posted January 21, 2015 (edited) Introduction My adventures in the NU tier continue. Those who know me (as in, really know me) also know that I am a lover of roleplaying. When I play a RPG, I want to feel the part, I want to really live my character as hif his life was my own... And because of this, I have always wanted to create a Pokemon team that I could really feel as mine, a team that I could use in a game and in the competitive scene alike, to really feel that, upon playing competitively, I am expanding and deepening the game experience, to truly live the RPG experience of a Pokemon game; a team that I could be able to include in my signature here on Reborn, and say "ehi, this is my team". Not "the team of the character in the game", not "the team I use on the ladder": MY team. Unfortunately, I have never been able to achieve this, because usually teams built to beat a Pokemon game have little competitive value (if at all) and, vice-versa, teams built to be competitive hardly keep in mind in-game needs... Untill the other day I re-played through Pokemon Soul Silver (a personal favorite): after a bit of work, I was able to put together a team consisting of Feraligatr, Ninetales, Vileplume, Sandslash, Granbull, and the special Dragonite that knows Extremespeed, which is given to you as a gift at some point. From my latest experiences in the NU tier, I knew that 5 of those Pokemon were not only allowed in that tier, but had also the potential to be very effective in it. So yeah, I just replaced Dragonite with my beloved NU sweeper Malamar, I tweaked the movesets a bit with competitive needs in mind, and that is how this team was born. At a glance This team doesn't look particularly intimidating or particularly effective, but somehow it works. It was able to carry me to some decent peak before I stopped going on Showdown a couple of days ago (I am preparing an exam for university, so no time to waste...), and in general it can address most situations you'll find yourself in when playing NU. As the diversity and complexity of nowadays competitive scene (in general, not just in NU) is constantly increasing, the idea is not to address all the possible threats from a defensive point of view (I have found that having a safe switch-in for everything is almost impossible): rather, what you are trying to do here is to address all the possible threats from an offensive point of view. Simply put, the idea is to use your 4 bulky Pokemon (and Stealth Rock) to take a hit, strike back, and force switches, in order to wear down the opposition: when the occasion presents itself, send out one of the two sweepers and start attacking. Feraligatr and Malamar have similar checks (for example, bulky Grass-type mons, Mantine and Qwilfish/Weezing are often used against both), so the idea is that to send out one mid-game, and just keep on attacking untill it is brought down. At this point, the checks the opponent used against it will probably be so worn out, that the other will be able to come in and succesfully pull off a sweep. Of course now I am putting it in very simplicistic terms: in practice, it takes much more skill and strategy to consistently pull off such a gameplan, but yeah, this is more or less the basic idea...@ LeftoversAbility: TorrentEVs: 184 HP / 252 Atk / 72 SpeAdamant Nature- Swords Dance- Waterfall- Aqua Jet- Ice PunchIf you play NU, you know this guy. Bulky SD is quickly becoming the most common set for Feraligatr, and for a damn good reason: the sheer amount of fast-yet-fragile threats that are prospering in the tier nowadays requires you to carry at least one priority user, and between its decent bulk and its access to Swords Dance, Feraligatr is perfect for the role, as it can just come into something that cannot beat it one-on-one, use a Swords Dance on the switch, and then just steamroll through most teams, using Aqua Jet to put the hurt on anything it cannot outspeed. Having decent staying power on top of fantastic offensive presence, Feraligatr is ideal to "soften up" enemy walls as part of the aforementioned strategy, so that Malamar can come in and finish the job later. Or, if the opponent has Pokemon that are frail but can boost their own speed and resist Superpower (Vivillon comes to mind), you can do the reverse: use Malamar to "soften up" opposition, and then explot Feraligatr's priority to finish the job. And you can rest assured, your faithful starter will do a great job either way. @ Assault VestAbility: Flash FireEVs: 248 HP / 252 SpA / 8 SpDModest Nature- Fire Blast- Dark Pulse- Psyshock- Energy BallAs Andy Warhol would say, the 15 minutes of celebrity are over. All but forgotten for 4 long generations, Ninetales suddenly became a prominent OU force in Gen 5 thanks to Drought, but now that Gen 6 has nerfed weather (and given us a much better OU Drought user in Mega Charizard Y), our beloved kitsune has fallen to the bottom of the food chain once again. But the very generation that took away its moment of glory also gave it a new toy to play with: Assault Vest. Ninetales is a strange Pokemon: it has an immense special movepool, but its SpAtk, while decent, is not that great, while its SpD is very good, but not backed by a good support movepool nor by an adequate HP stat to be a full-on defensive Pokemon. Assault Vest allows you to invest all your EVs in SpAtk and HP and still have a very good SpD, netting you a rather bulky Pokemon that also has a strong offensive presence. And the "must run 4 offensive moves" limitation hardly matters, because Ninetales has a fantastic movepool to pick from. Fire Blast is the main STAB, Dark Pulse is for bulky Psychic-type mons that can take Fire Blast but cannot pose an immediate threat for Ninetales (Grumpig for example), Psyshock is for Hariyama (dealing more damage than the specially-oriented Extrasensory, because most Hariyama sets nowadays carry Assault Vest) and Energy Ball is for Seismitoad (which is OHKOed by it). With Assault Vest, you'll be able to shrug off the coverage moves of every Fire-type special attacker not named Camerupt, and Flash Fire will give you immunity to their main STAB: I honestly believe this is something that gives Ninetales a niche over, say, Typhlosion or Magmortar, while being better than Heatmor at this job thanks to better bulk and the ability to hurt Hariyama and Seismitoad. Please do keep it mind however that, while Psyshock deals more damage to Hariyama than Extrasensory, thus allowing you to seriously hurt it if you predict right on the switch, Ninetales will still lose to Hariyama in a one-on-one situation, so do not carelessly stay in if Hariyama gets a free switch-in... @ Black SludgeAbility: Effect SporeEVs: 248 HP / 8 SpA / 252 SpDCalm Nature- Giga Drain- Sludge Bomb- Synthesis- AromatherapyVileplume is a useful Pokemon to have. Capable of beating virtually any other Grass-type in the tier (including the dreaded Serperior), with great special bulk, offensive moves that hit decentrly hard and help keep in check the few yet relevant Fairy-type threats, and the ability to keep itself and its companions healthy, which never hurts. Aromatherapy is particularly important because both the sweepers used for the aforementioned "wear down and break through" strategy are very afraid of being burned: granted, Ninetales can safely switch into most WoW users, but that's not the only way a guy can get statused: for example, there is Magmortar's ability... @ LeftoversAbility: Sand VeilEVs: 248 HP / 8 Atk / 252 DefImpish Nature- Earthquake- Knock Off- Rapid Spin- Stealth RockThe dev team really thinks of everything. In the very generation they introduced a stronger, virtually unstoppable way of removing entry hazards, they also improved Knock Off and gave it to most users of Rapid Spin, to give them an edge over ghosts and make sure they stay relevant. Sandslash is very good at its job: bulky, with good offensive presence, with the ability to set up SR and remove those set by the opponent, and its tendency to lure in Mismagius for Knock Off to cripple. And the ability to take a lot of hits from most things people usually use as leads nowadays doesn't hurt, either.Once it has done its job, it is the number one choice for sacking, but this is something that shouldn't be done carelessly: always plan ahead before doing anything, resource management is vital with this kind of teams... @ LeftoversAbility: IntimidateEVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 DefImpish Nature- Play Rough- Roar- Thunder Wave- ProtectGranbull has been a mainstay in all my teams since I started playing NU. I just happen to like the guy, and a bulky Fairy-type (with Intimidate to boot) in a tier full of physically offensive Fighting-type mons doesn't hurt either.In a previous thread I was advised against using Roar, but after giving a try to countless other moves (Crunch, Fire Fang, Seismic Toss, Earthquake) I honestly have to say I wasn't satisfied with any of them: on the other hand, Roar can come in handy in many different occasions, and in general it is good to have a phazer nowadays, with all those set-up sweepers and Baton Passers around. Thunder Wave is particularly important, as it gives a crucial help to Feraligatr and Malamar, as part of the aforementioned strategy. @ Choice ScarfAbility: ContraryEVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 SpeJolly Nature- Superpower- Knock Off- Psycho Cut- SwitcherooAnd here it is, my current favorite Pokemon. I have used this exact same set in the past, however in this team I don't Switcheroo away my Choice Scarf as often: once opponents have been worn out by the rest of the team, locking yourself into Superpower is nice to push for victory. In general, if the opponent has even one Pokemon that is naturally faster than Malamar, you are better off keeping the Choice Scarf: only use Switcheroo against full stall teams, where the payoff is just too big to ignore it, and most Pokemon can be outrun anyway... It is important to notice that the 3 offensive moves have perfect neutral coverage, so it is very hard for opponents to switch into Malamar: granted, they'll most likely asume you are going to spam Superpower and act accordingly, but if you can correctly predict this, chances are you'll be able to punch some serious holes in the opposing team, something that is particularly important to do when it is Malamar who is paving the way for Feraligatr, and not the other way around... Conclusions I always say the same stuff in this last part... Feel free to try for yourself, do not point out problems without suggesting solutions, keep in mind the balance (and, in this case, the spirit) of the team when suggesting a change, avoid picking fights, etc etc etc... Importable below. Feraligatr @ LeftoversAbility: TorrentEVs: 184 HP / 252 Atk / 72 SpeAdamant Nature- Swords Dance- Waterfall- Aqua Jet- Ice PunchNinetales @ Assault VestAbility: Flash FireEVs: 248 HP / 252 SpA / 8 SpDModest Nature- Fire Blast- Dark Pulse- Psyshock- Energy BallVileplume @ Black SludgeAbility: Effect SporeEVs: 248 HP / 8 SpA / 252 SpDCalm Nature- Giga Drain- Sludge Bomb- Synthesis- AromatherapySandslash @ LeftoversAbility: Sand VeilEVs: 248 HP / 8 Atk / 252 DefImpish Nature- Earthquake- Knock Off- Rapid Spin- Stealth RockGranbull @ LeftoversAbility: IntimidateEVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 DefImpish Nature- Play Rough- Roar- Thunder Wave- ProtectMalamar @ Choice ScarfAbility: ContraryEVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 SpeJolly Nature- Superpower- Knock Off- Psycho Cut- Switcheroo Edited January 22, 2015 by Tomas Elliot Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jelly Posted January 21, 2015 Share Posted January 21, 2015 i'd suggest running 72 speed on gatr to hit a point where you outspeed neutral natured max speed base 55 mons like cacturne, eggy, and golurk. cacturne and eggy especially cause problems for gatr. the only thing i see you might have trouble with is switching into steelix once slash is gone. but that's the same as every other team ever so dont worry about that x.x v solid team i'll look into using it later today :> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tomas Elliot Posted January 21, 2015 Author Share Posted January 21, 2015 i'd suggest running 72 speed on gatr to hit a point where you outspeed neutral natured max speed base 55 mons like cacturne, eggy, and golurk. cacturne and eggy especially cause problems for gatr. the only thing i see you might have trouble with is switching into steelix once slash is gone. but that's the same as every other team ever so dont worry about that x.x v solid team i'll look into using it later today :> Ah I see, I always have troubles setting EVs in speed (unless it is the mindless 252 lol), as I am still not very knowledgeable of the speed tiers. I shall test the spread you suggest Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AuthorReborn Posted January 21, 2015 Share Posted January 21, 2015 I'll try out this team at some point today and give you feedback based on what I discover. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tomas Elliot Posted January 22, 2015 Author Share Posted January 22, 2015 Updated the OP with Gen 6 sprites, and tweaked Feraligatr's EVs as Jelly suggested! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raindrop Valkyrie Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 Not that it super duper matters, though it would be a good idea to mention that not only does roar phaze set-up sweepers it also racks up some SR damage. This can definitely assist in chipping away at some pokes ((and heck, could pull out stuff Vivillion and do a butt load of damage to it that it didn't want to take.)). So, it could be a worthwhile strategy to keep in mind against certain teams especially if they carry rock weak mons. As I am not 100% familiar with the the tier...not sure this suggestion will matter, but Psyshock could be mentioned as a possible alternative to Extrasensory... but I am not actually sure if it hits anything for better damage than Extrasensory will. Flamethrower could also be listed as a more accurate STAB move, but I feel Ninetales really can't afford to run it. Its SpAtk is pretty middling so any extra power is pretty much needed. Anyways, the team is pretty air tight, or at least it seems to be to me, hence why I am bringing up pretty minor junk lol. I rather like the crew ya got here and it flows well with most things being covered and nothing completely running through the team. ((I still personally believe Fire is a better Defensive type than people think. Most are probably put off by rocks damage being 25%, but eh. This is why I kinda dig the Ninetales set as it looks like it makes a rather decent bulky attacker, and with Flash Fire it can grab a nice boost for itself sometimes which might mitigate it's bleh SpAtk. That or it will at least deter them from just throwing Will-o-Wisps and Fire Moves around like candy. An interesting set that I am sure many aren't entirely prepared for when they face your team.)) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tomas Elliot Posted January 22, 2015 Author Share Posted January 22, 2015 Not that it super duper matters, though it would be a good idea to mention that not only does roar phaze set-up sweepers it also racks up some SR damage. This can definitely assist in chipping away at some pokes ((and heck, could pull out stuff Vivillion and do a butt load of damage to it that it didn't want to take.)). So, it could be a worthwhile strategy to keep in mind against certain teams especially if they carry rock weak mons. As I am not 100% familiar with the the tier...not sure this suggestion will matter, but Psyshock could be mentioned as a possible alternative to Extrasensory... but I am not actually sure if it hits anything for better damage than Extrasensory will. Flamethrower could also be listed as a more accurate STAB move, but I feel Ninetales really can't afford to run it. Its SpAtk is pretty middling so any extra power is pretty much needed. Anyways, the team is pretty air tight, or at least it seems to be to me, hence why I am bringing up pretty minor junk lol. I rather like the crew ya got here and it flows well with most things being covered and nothing completely running through the team. ((I still personally believe Fire is a better Defensive type than people think. Most are probably put off by rocks damage being 25%, but eh. This is why I kinda dig the Ninetales set as it looks like it makes a rather decent bulky attacker, and with Flash Fire it can grab a nice boost for itself sometimes which might mitigate it's bleh SpAtk. That or it will at least deter them from just throwing Will-o-Wisps and Fire Moves around like candy. An interesting set that I am sure many aren't entirely prepared for when they face your team.)) ... Ninetales gets Psyshock? Heck I had no idea, of course Psyshock is better than Extrasensory, as Hariyama (which is the reason for carrying a Psychic-type move in the first place) is always seen with Assault Vest nowadays, meaning that a move hitting its physical defense will always deal more damage than a move hitting its special defense... Thanks for pointing that out, I'll edit the OP immediately! That aside, thank you for the positive feedback, I appreciate it: I have always been fond of Ninetales, so I was glad when it was given a way to capitalize on its strange stat distribution... And the fact that most people won't see it coming only adds to it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raindrop Valkyrie Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 TFW you knew something about a tier you don't even play..... Glad I could help XD. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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