Has the game moved away from it's original premise?

[zareason]

Just like many of you I was greeted by the infamous "so you wanna play reborn .." post before starting the game, a post that to this day sends shock waves down my spine every time I read it, but after beating the current episode i realized that what was described in the post is only mildly present in the game. Of course the game has constantly been changing via input from the community for the better but that doesn't exclude it from any analysis.

Concerning Areas:

Starting off with the state of Reborn City itself, an almost inhabitable area for pokemon with a poisoned lake and constant earthquakes it portrays the difficulty of the game and the state of it's world. Having no good wild pokemons before the first gym barring event pokemon made the game feel more challenging as well as fresh. But i feel that as we got out of the city that feeling never came back. I am not against the beautiful and pokemon abundant areas present in the game but have they been implemented too early? After just five gyms that feeling of being on the edge vanishes(excluding the wasteland) suddenly we can access vast open areas with a lot of new pokemon and with a decrease in specific event pokemon. Having too many secluded areas would be repetitive and boring but limitations to Pokemon availability and grass would have kept the tension.

Concerning Money:

At the beginning of the game, the premise of living like a hobo is followed, but as the game goes on the price of new items does not scale proportionately with the amount of money we get by beating trainers. It's not something that has started by reaching the point of the end game, but again something that has started just after leaving the city. Personally i have rarely used potions/revives in battle but ultra potions should cost more then 1000 and certain side quest related items like honey should get a bump in price. Also the power items are way too cheap, the game doesn't require EV training, giving us the items is a blessing in itself which is why we should choose between getting a couple instead of just buying all of them.

Concerning Difficulty/Pokemon:

Having not played previous episodes i can not comment on the evolution of the difficulty of the game, all i can say that it has been somewhat coherent with the premise. Every upcoming badge makes me prepare in advance and even then they take a couple of restarts due to the field effects. Fortunately knowing about the gyms in advance has been a blessing which i have abused so going in blind next time should make it more difficult. But most of the team meteor fights other then Pulse Tangela and Heather have been lacking compared to the gym fights. When it comes to pokemon ones like magikarp have been removed and many other tweaks have been made concerning their availability or place of availability. Overall the lack of pseudo legendaries makes the game more difficult but later on we get way too many strong pokemon without giving up anything. With the addition of the new floors in the obsidia department store it looks like Electivire and such are going to come back but concerning we still officialy don't have access to it then we can't tell when that will be. I don't know what future updates will bring but i hope we do not get a pesudo legendary dragon.

Overall i think the pokemon we have access to is well balanced for the difficulty of the game. but their is a lack of choice or sacrifice. Looking at the additional 5 starter pokemon excluding the black market it would have been more rewarding to have different side quests or one major side quest where at the end we get to have only one or two. Just like how we have to sacrifice not having pinsir in order to get heracross but with pokemon that do not have type similairties such as a choice between a physic/ghost type. This as well as an increase in events and a decrease in the number of pokemon available in the wild(while keeping them in game via events) as well as more choice related events would make your squad feel more unique. In addition to that having pokemon only available to some characters in the game would add to that. One of the biggest bumps i had is being utterly destroyed by the Garchomp of Solaris, telling myself it's the only one in the game and how patiently i awaited a rematch for me to fight Garchomp again when battling Terra.

Conclusion:

Personally i find that the game has somewhat evolved from the initial experience i had, but at the same time it's beauty has given me amazing experiences that i didn't expect. This isn't a critique of the game, it's more of an observation with a couple of suggestions.

[Etesian]

Well, that's kinda natural. I mean, the beginning tells us how everything's bad, then we found out Team Meteor is at fault, then we started going after them; there's only so much time you can spend with any part, gotta move on; and in this case, move out. And the environment is about the only thing that's changed; yeah, the City has the lake and previous earthquakes, but Spinel had the Abra, whatever-its-called City has the Sleep Pulse, the mountain was blocked off so people could starve. We're getting to new areas that look nicer, but every area has it's own troubles, they just have more grass is the only real difference.

Well, increasing the cost of items has never been a thing in any Pokemon game and, honestly, who even uses 'em? The only money I ever spent was on the Power Items, the Daycare and that one staircase. Even if things were more expensive, who'd care? Speaking of Power Items, I definitely do not agree with only some being obtainable. Their only purpose is to speed things up, so it wouldn't even matter if we were given them for free. And they're not even that cheap, when you first get access to them, unless you sell everything you have, you'll only get 2 at best.

You also have to keep in mind that higher difficulty means more failures which means people will be buying more stuff. Considering that we have no way to grind for money, increasing the cost of things combined with over-all difficulty would just be artificial difficulty.

As for availability, do keep in mind that 1) all Pokemon are supposed to be obtainable by the end and 2) there's only 5 more episodes to go. You can limit what's obtainable (and how much of it is) only by so much if we're already 75% through the game already.

And for not-gym-leaders being easier than gym leaders, figures! They're supposed to be the greatest challenge around, can't have a random grunt be as strong as a gym leader. And you're also looking past the challenge of the Pulses (except for Tangrowth because of the field or Acid Spray/Screech) and other random events, like the Taka and Zel double battle, gym leaders definitely aren't the only source of a good challenge.

[Tomas Elliot]

The fact that this game evolves according to the feedback of the community is what makes the experience on this forum so great. The game IS the community in a way, and the community IS the game. And with so many people being part of it, it is only natural that it would evolve. Or at least I think so.

[Gaunt]

Interesting considerations, Etesian already answered everything i only have a thing to add about the difficulty of the game, which is (of course) pretty high especially considering how easy are the main ones but i feel that the sense of dread i had (in earlier episodes) before every "major" battle, that feel of "surviving only by luck" is now gone. If you noticed many good/challenging opponents (mainly Gym Leaders) got nerfed (sometimes heavily) because a part of the community kept complaining about it (it's of course only part of the reason but still) i really want that "feel" back.

[Guzam]

There is a reason hax queen Serra is getting a new team and field effect for episode 15. I feel like she will finally bring back that old Reborn difficulty that some of you all use to love. That is if Charlotte hasn't provided you enough difficulty yet.

Anyway the game still feels like it has that great dark presence it's known for. You see how distraught everything is and you're always wondering what could you do to help, but the thing is, you're helpless and left to where the story takes us. The game makes me feel like I need to do something about the situation, when in reality it is all taking care of itself in its own dark way.

[zareason]

Well, that's kinda natural. I mean, the beginning tells us how everything's bad, then we found out Team Meteor is at fault, then we started going after them; there's only so much time you can spend with any part, gotta move on; and in this case, move out. And the environment is about the only thing that's changed; yeah, the City has the lake and previous earthquakes, but Spinel had the Abra, whatever-its-called City has the Sleep Pulse, the mountain was blocked off so people could starve. We're getting to new areas that look nicer, but every area has it's own troubles, they just have more grass is the only real difference.

Well, increasing the cost of items has never been a thing in any Pokemon game and, honestly, who even uses 'em? The only money I ever spent was on the Power Items, the Daycare and that one staircase. Even if things were more expensive, who'd care? Speaking of Power Items, I definitely do not agree with only some being obtainable. Their only purpose is to speed things up, so it wouldn't even matter if we were given them for free. And they're not even that cheap, when you first get access to them, unless you sell everything you have, you'll only get 2 at best.

You also have to keep in mind that higher difficulty means more failures which means people will be buying more stuff. Considering that we have no way to grind for money, increasing the cost of things combined with over-all difficulty would just be artificial difficulty.

As for availability, do keep in mind that 1) all Pokemon are supposed to be obtainable by the end and 2) there's only 5 more episodes to go. You can limit what's obtainable (and how much of it is) only by so much if we're already 75% through the game already.

And for not-gym-leaders being easier than gym leaders, figures! They're supposed to be the greatest challenge around, can't have a random grunt be as strong as a gym leader. And you're also looking past the challenge of the Pulses (except for Tangrowth because of the field or Acid Spray/Screech) and other random events, like the Taka and Zel double battle, gym leaders definitely aren't the only source of a good challenge.

For the power items, the suggestion is to bump their price, so you wouldn't be able to buy them all. Having too chose between a couple.

I wasn't aware that all pokemon are going to be obtainable at the end. Guess i'm going to have to resist catching them.

[dondon151]

I don't know why so many people want old Serra back; a battle that you can barely strategize around due to heavy proliferation of luck-based elements is terrible design.

RPGs always appear to get easier as they progress because player options expand and they get more tools to deal with potential threats. If you wanted to maintain earlygame difficulty, you'd also have to limit player options, and a huge component of the fun of playing RPGs (but Pokemon in particular) is the wealth of options available for the player to choose from.

Reborn is still doing this with TM availability; currently there are few good TMs available and the game sacrifices customization in favor of difficulty that's a product of the player having more limited options. I'm of the opinion that this makes the game slightly less fun overall.

Edited May 11, 2015 by dondon151

[Etesian]

For the power items, the suggestion is to bump their price, so you wouldn't be able to buy them all. Having too chose between a couple.

I know what you mean, but then again, the only purpose of those items is saving time, difficulty isn't altered in any way.

[NameNotFound]

For the power items, the suggestion is to bump their price, so you wouldn't be able to buy them all. Having too chose between a couple.

I wasn't aware that all pokemon are going to be obtainable at the end. Guess i'm going to have to resist catching them.

If somebody doesn't like the power items he/she simply doesn't have to buy them. You can make the game challenging for you by using weaker mons or something like that. I don't have time to kill 252 Tauroses to perfectly EV train my Azumarill for example. They just make everything faster. There's nothing challenging in spending half of your day in front of PC EV training a single mon. I like EV training and I've been doing it since I've started the game, it really helps, Charlotte still rekt me though. Some gym leaders should be buffed, like Serra, Terra, she's ridiculously weak, my Greninja completly destroyed her (khm Grass Knot). I found nerfed Noel weak, aswell as nerfed Aya (although she caught me off guard because of the field effect). If weaker gym leaders had EV trained mons I'm sure they wouldn't be such a pushover.

[Odybld]

My two cents on difficulty.

I really don't think the leaders got that nerfed. I've only played them in E14, but I'll use shofu as a measuring stick, who had no problems against pre-"nerf" Aya and pre-"nerf" Noel, while getting badly beaten by Luna and Samson, who had the fields with them. I just think that the teams were a little bit nerfed to balance the introduction of the Field Effects, with the fight staying about as challenging. Ok, Noel now has no tools against steel, he needs some more fire in his team (Pyroar?), but his healing field greatly helps his ace Clefable if not destroyed, and even if burned, it puts more pressure to the non-Magic Guard user. Aya got underleveled, but she doesn't have to deal with EQs destroying her whole team other than Gengar.

And Hax Queen Serra with Hail + Snow Warning is actually the first time a leader team was helped by its surroundings. Kinda like the Field effects.

As of Charlotte, I didn't play her when she opened with a Ninetales, but she's also better off now. Hits a little bit weaker in the start, but Darmanitan gives her a little bit physical attack, the rest is 5 special attackers. Imagine starting against the old Charlotte with a Prankster with Light Screen/Rain Dance and a Blissey with Heal Pulse, Softboiled and Light Screen. The Prankster sets the first screen or the rain and dies, and Blissey spends all of the battle healing itself or its partner with both moves and potions, or putting a new screen. She needs one more tool against special walls.

We learn, bit by bit. We learn that this monster of a Cradily can be one-shoted by a prepared Fury Cutter. We learn how to deal with all the threats coming our way, we adapt and when we replay the game, it seems easier. I'd like to see an expert mode where all the leaders get a buff, be it getting some levels up, getting more fully evolved Pokemon (for the ones before Kiki), and some fields get more adverse or haxy. But we're currently fine.

And Charlotte is great. A great spook story. Cradily is a great spook story. But we can bring them down very easily.

[dondon151]

My two cents on difficulty.

In addition to this, I just want to point out that one person's perception of a particular opponent's difficulty isn't an accurate representation of that opponent's difficulty on the whole. Many gym leaders in Reborn are profoundly weak to specific strategies (which is kind of a good thing) and players will naturally have or not have Pokemon who can dip into those strategies as they play through the game. Most people claim that Noel is difficult, for example, but I have never beaten Noel in more than 8 turns. Does that mean that Noel isn't difficult? It probably doesn't.

[Personthing]

Well the thing about Pokemon availability is, we can't be stuck in early game hell forever. That'd just be no fun at all. Options open up as the game progresses, and that's only natural, and as more options are available, the game becomes a bit easier. You still have to go out of your way to get many of the good pokemon. In regards to the areas becoming more open after you leave Reborn city, well it kind of makes sense. It's not like the whole region has to be ruined, and the areas you access after you return (7th street), still capture that grimy, desolate feeling that the city is supposed to give off.

Edited May 12, 2015 by Mighty Kamina