Who Is/Was: [Player]?

[Chase]

Hey guys.

 

I hope to make another series of discussions on this board throughout the coming weeks to talk about some of our favorite (or not) Reborn personalities. Before I get into the first one (or.....like...six...or like however many of us play this game) - I'd like to get a few things in the clear beforehand.

 

• I am aware that many of Reborn's personalities are inspired by the developer's past and personalities on the original "Reborn League." Don't waste a post explaining to everyone in the discussion things like "Corey is someone Amethyst knew that died in said manner", "Sigmund was like that in the League", or "Ame is Amethyst's self insert." - No duh, right?
• I humbly come before you all understanding that I don't know everything and verily state as such. The purpose of this thread is to exchange what we know and what is widely believed so that we can profile each character as thoroughly as possible and engage in thoughtful discussion.
• This series will not go EXACTLY in order of appearance, but the cast will be covered -roughly- as such. This is to allow newer players who may not have progressed as far to at least know who we're talking about.

 

We square? Great.

 

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Today, we're going to talk about ourselves first, because interestingly enough, there's a few juicy tidbits about ...well.....us... enough to where we actually start such a series talking about the player character.

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Are you a boy? or are you a girl? (Or are you neither?)

 

Pokemon Reborn starts off much like any other adventure in the world of Pokemon does, with someone who you just met providing expository information about why Pokemon is great...well, in Reborn's case, specifically the idea of challenging the Pokemon League. The player meets the mysterious "Ame", who seems like a League administrator in this opening character creation screen, hears about Reborn a bit, is asked if they would like to know how to be controlled (because that's normal.), and finally, is asked to state their gender identity.

 

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What are Saturdays for? THE BOYS!

 

If the player selects 'BOY', they are given a choice between the sporty, pale, jet-black haired guy, and the guy with the white hair and threads wearing sunshades and holding claim to a darker skin complexion. The white guy is Vero - and his signature clothing is accented with a gold chain and some really sick fingerless gloves. Sunglasses McGee is known as Kuro - which I would have to assume means "black"...in like ...Japanese or something. Real on the nose, but it's a really cool name and rhymes with the white guys name, so it works in a side-by-side comparison. Vero and Kuro would make for a super neat buddy-cop movie.

 

Selecting a male protagonist lends the player absolutely nothing....at least to my knowledge.... in the "relationship point" department. "Points" are earned and lost for making various choices/as consequence for certain actions. These points effect the ending of the completed game in some way. This will matter in the other two genders.

 

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Girls just want to have fun.

 

If the player selects 'GIRL' they are given the choice between the beautiful Alice, a blonde who notably looks the most like a Pokemon Trainer out of all the protagonists. She reminds me of those "Cool Trainer" sprites from the older games.....and the lovely Lucia, who wins the award for 'best hair' in the protagonist department (in my opinion.) Alice serves as the lighter skinned protagonist choice while Lucia services those who are looking for more of an ebony skin color. If I were to think of a movie for Alice and Lucia, I would think the duo would fit best in a teen spy drama where one serves as an undercover spy/student and the other is her "BFF".

 

Selecting a female protagonist lends the player with an easy relationship point with Samson, the replacement Fighting-type Gym Leader. Samson will start his gym battle with the courtly-courteous phrase "Ladies First." - at which point the player will (not) notice their relationship with Samson had improved. Samson will balance out his available relationship points by only offering the girl protag ONE point for beating Ciel (the flying gym leader) on their first try where he would award two to a male or nonbinary protagonist, making the count at this point in time, 2 points for everyone.

 

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Something something Apache Helicopter.

 

if the player selects neither option, they are given the choice between Ari, a sporty type who has the punk rock hairdo and looks like someone you don't want to make angry, and Decibel, who looks like they are the flagship mascot character of this game with xyr's color scheme. The thing that comes to mind with these two in terms of media? Anime. For sure.

Deci serves as the pale alternative to Ari, and Ari the tanned alternative to Deci.

 

Selecting a non-binary protagonist lends the player a relationship point with Adrienn, the Fairy-type Gym Leader, who also identifies as non-binary. The identifier for this within the game is your rival, Cain, who will say something along the lines of "So that's why you're both so cute!"

 

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You either die a Hero...

 

Starting with the positive opinion of the player, we have Anna, a young girl living in Reborn City's Orphanage with her twin brother Noel and who is in care of a Jirachi doll that apparently has the ability to communicate with her. The game seems to imply that Anna has the ability to "see" or "not see" things that are not there/there to others, usually seen through her brother's protesting. Regarding the player character, Anna claims that they appear to be "glowy". This is followed by a genuinely friendly reception of the protagonist following her first encounter with them.

 

The expansive official League cast will regard the player with approval depending on the player's progress through the story. Being allowed to assist in the Obsidia Ward clean up, being called a wrecking ball, being told your perception of the Ditto Arceus was sharp, and so on and so forth generate various minor praise lines from allies in the fight against Team Meteor, the orderlies at the Orphanage, and the Arceus cult.

 

At the end of the current episode (16 for past reference) Ame, the mysterious League official from the start of the game, is now dead. The player learns in quite possibly the last conversation they have with her that she was the Reborn League Champion, and her death has left the post vacant. Adrienn approaches you with a personal plan of xyr own for you - to have you earn Ame's former post. (because, you weren't here to do that anyway - but you know...details) Adrienn personally beseeching you to rise up to the challenge is positive praise.

 

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...or live long enough to see yourself become the Villain.

 

There are some pretty interesting contrasts to the high regard the player character has, or at least some very interesting observations.

 

The most obvious is your ever deteriorating image according to your rival Fern. Fern grows to absolutely hate your guts as you progress through the story, eventually joining Team Meteor in opposition to you.

 

Shade, the Ghost-type Gym Leader, and mysterious entity that doesn't even appear to be human in the slightest, utters a neutral quote to the player after being defeated and showing the player the Orphanage children being kidnapped through a TV screen. The quote insinuates that the souls in the video monitor (and possibly elsewhere in the region) are dying, and that those same souls hold the "keys" to the players' gain. He then admonishes the player to not let their inevitable deaths be in vain. It's a rather dark request, which doesn't paint the player character in the greatest light because it leaves open the possibility that we are shameless opportunists in a world that is struggling for survival.

 

The Gothitelle residing in the Beryl Library can offer you a fortune sometime in the game. She will say that you will enter "the void"- followed by something like a turn of phrase equivalent to "God must not know" featuring Pokemon Creator God Arceus - which may or may not be important to the plot of the game. It reads - to me - simply like the player will cease to exist in the future. Spoilers! You die! And you thought you were special?

 

However, a human fortune teller in New Jasper will give another fortune for the player character. This fortune however seems to be more concerned with Reborn City than it does with you, because again, you seem to be absent from the future. Here, the woman talks about a boy with a beaded tooth necklace, another with spiked braces, yet another with azure hair, and a girl with a sleeping star, and a woman in a red and black suit. The group seems to tackle the same tasks the player did, as the fortune teller mentions the plants yet again ravaging the area. The effort seems to falter, as the man with the bracelets falls into a fissure, the azure hair is RE-dyed red and the man is facing off against his kin, and the beaded necklace bearer "breaks apart". The fortune not only erases the player from it, but also indicates that Reborn City "lives up to it's name" through the destruction. Ultimately, these foresights by the Pokemon and the Seer lead us to believe we DON'T actually save the region.

 

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So. What do you guys think? What did I miss?

 

Which thread would you guys like to see next?

 

- The mysterious League official, Ame

-OR- the spurned rival, Fern?

 

 

[Commander]

So I'm going to first start with relationship points: I think Ame bit off more than she can chew trying to implement this system so late in development. We only know what it does internally as it never shows up externally or impacts the game. This is added with the fact most players who have played pre E16 probably aren't going to restart their files. Persona has a relationship system, but the game is centered around it and is a big focus. I could name a few others but I don't really see anything that works like Reborn...oh Tales of Symphonia. I could see it working, but Reborn's is like 4 times as big as that game's.

 

I hate leading this off on a pessimistic note, but Reborn's protag is the weakest thing about the game. It's not even that they are silent, but more of the fact they aren't the star of the game. That sound really weird that the player character isn't the main protagonist, but that is due to how Reborn is structured. 90% of the game you aren't in control. Let's start with the beginning of the game: You are save from a train crash by Ame in which she tells you to go to the Grand Hall. Once you reach there, you get pulled along for like 10 minutes worth of cutscenes then are back in control. This is one of the few instances where someone isn't pulling you for a ride and then we get to Mosswater. From that point we're ordered by Florinia and then kind of get pushed around or go with the flow. We went to Coral Ward because the Police wouldn't let us by. This issue gets worse and worse as the game goes on. The problem is that the PC has no voice so we have to assume they are us even if we disagree with their decisions or choices.

 

Now we get into the whole prophecy stuff. The player dying or disappearing is one theory, but we don't know what the player character is or even if this prophecies are true or haven't happened already. I'd be more inclined to believe the protag would or could die if they talked as another character could replace or take over on their adventure. It'd be really weird for Ame to design a league heavy game that includes a post game if the player dies during or before the champion fight. Of course, they could be...Reborn (no pun...fuck that's probably going to happen). I really hate prophecies as it's just lazy forecasting in my opinion.

 

It was a good analysis regardless and I guess we should go for Ame next. Her in-game character ain't all that exciting though compared to the real one.

[Zander]

I'm wondering though that if we already did good stuff in the story before episode 16 was released, then do those points automatically get added up?

Also you meet a guy called Samson in the Beryl cemetery saying he's quitting Team meteor. So who's that guy and why does he have the same name as the fighting gym leader of Agate Circus?

[FairFamily]

The thing with the prophecies is that they are both open ended. The gothitelle clearly speaks that while she is describing the MC's future, there is time after meeting the void. So there is time for you after meeting inexistence which makes sense according to destiny's end. The prophecy from the fortune teller implies of a wish being granted. It is interesting that she is predicting the MC's future because he doesn't exist in this future. So this future must tie in with the player so maybe this future describes his revival/return through the wish. Another aspect about the MC is how is not afraid to perform some crimes. He joined a gang, stole a pokemon, is willing to buy pkmn from the black market,... . For the rest it was a good read.

 

[Yagami]

13 minutes ago, Zander said:

I'm wondering though that if we already did good stuff in the story before episode 16 was released, then do those points automatically get added up?

Also you meet a guy called Samson in the Beryl cemetery saying he's quitting Team meteor. So who's that guy and why does he have the same name as the fighting gym leader of Agate Circus?

His name was Simon.You fought against Simon and Tara ,the meteor grunts.

Tara died from Sapphrira's dragonite in Charlotte's house.

This is actually a sidequest for super rod and TM toxic.You need to meet with him again in his house.

[Ice Cream Sand Witch]

2 hours ago, Zander said:

I'm wondering though that if we already did good stuff in the story before episode 16 was released, then do those points automatically get added up?

Also you meet a guy called Samson in the Beryl cemetery saying he's quitting Team meteor. So who's that guy and why does he have the same name as the fighting gym leader of Agate Circus?

Yagami answered the second question, but for the first: save files players had pre-E16 will not have any relationship points before E16 story content. Since you would have already done the events before the relationship variables were in them, you wouldn't be able to get them unless you open the game in debug mode, find the control variables for each character's relationship value, and set them to what they would be if you had gotten them. That's what I did before starting E16 content. 

[Zander]

6 hours ago, Yagami said:

His name was Simon.You fought against Simon and Tara ,the meteor grunts.

Tara died from Sapphrira's dragonite in Charlotte's house.

This is actually a sidequest for super rod and TM toxic.You need to meet with him again in his house.

Oh okay, I see. Funny though that team meteor grunts actually get a side quest of their own. I'll do it sometime.

3 hours ago, Ice Cream Sand Witch said:

Since you would have already done the events before the relationship variables were in them, you wouldn't be able to get them unless you open the game in debug mode, find the control variables for each character's relationship value, and set them to what they would be if you had gotten them. That's what I did before starting E16 content. 

So all my relationship points are set to values based only on episode 16 then. Does this affect the obtainability of the shiny charm too? And how do you open this game in debug mode?

[Ice Cream Sand Witch]

3 minutes ago, Zander said:

Oh okay, I see. Funny though that team meteor grunts actually get a side quest of their own. I'll do it sometime.

So all my relationship points are set to values based only on episode 16 then. Does this affect the obtainability of the shiny charm too? And how do you open this game in debug mode?

You have to have RPG Maker to use debug mode. You'd open Reborn in RPG Maker and play from there, where "Debug" is an option in the menu screen. Then in debug you'd go to "Variables" and find the ones with character names followed by relationship (ex: "Terra Relationship"). 

 

I don't see any reason why it would effect the obtainability of the Shiny Charm. 

[Zander]

9 minutes ago, Ice Cream Sand Witch said:

You have to have RPG Maker to use debug mode. You'd open Reborn in RPG Maker and play from there, where "Debug" is an option in the menu screen. Then in debug you'd go to "Variables" and find the ones with character names followed by relationship (ex: "Terra Relationship"). 

 

I don't see any reason why it would effect the obtainability of the Shiny Charm. 

Well I guess I'll download RPG maker sometime later if I feel like. I think that if you don't get enough relationship points then you have to do side quests to make up for them? I'm honestly interested in seeing what those will be. And can we get the different ending in the same run or restarting is necessary?

I don't remember then if I answered Blake in all nos or not but the father in Calcenon is not allowing me in her room so I guess not.

 

Also hope you're alright after the hurricane

[Chase]

As silly as having the player character Houdini their way back into the material world of Reborn City, it's certainly feasible.

 

1. @Commander is absolutely correct in asserting that the player's longevity is at least assured with regards to being able to have a somewhat normal Pokémon Post-game experience. In order to do that, we as players will likely have to survive/succeed in the League push, and there's a solid chance Meteor will stand in our way unless the game's Pokémon experience takes center stage from this point forward rather than the game's story.

 

2. If the prophecies are open-ended and there is meant to be time afterwards (and Commander asserting the player's need to exist in order to complete the PokeDex.) There isn't room for death or removal from the plane of existence to be temporary. The Gothitelle fortune very clearly is an open ended fortune, because she is only able to see you "joining the void" before her vision can provide any more details. It seems possible that people may be reading a bit too far into the Gothitelle fortune because the end may simply be the Pokémon version of the turn of phrase "after that, God knows what will happen..", however, it can't just mean that the player is gone for good, because there is indeed a planned post game at this point in time. The New Jasper Fortune Teller doesn't provide any direct insight about the player to definitively say they are the one wished for - but being summoned via a wish from Jirachi would give us the leeway we need to operate in the future Reborn City has and right the wrongs that have transpired since we disappeared.

 

I picture it happening like this. The player gets hit by some sort of massive threat under Meteor's control. A "Pulse-Arceus" seems quite literal, but Pulse-powered Judgement sending us to some alternative dimension that represents Non-existence would fulfill the Gothitelle prophecy. It happens much in the way Harry Potter ends up in the Deathly Hollows, presumably defeated in the previous world. Arceus in the non-existence world - or Giratina - or something - is the only other thing in the plane besides the player, and after a long existential exposition dump or some sort of strange stumbling around in the dark sequence the wish takes place (either via a cutscene or something else) and we arrive back in a newly destroyed Reborn City alongside the person who called for us. I guess we should stop treating the theme of Rebirth as a joke. Right??

 

 

Ame leads the interest vote by 1....out of 1 votes.

 

 

[Ice Cream Sand Witch]

Ame said people are going to hate her after E17. At first I wondered if it was going to be when Miss Direction's prophecy happened (since things like the player not existing and Fern being a hero sound unpleasant) but now I don't really think so, for 2 reasons. 

1. Ame said E17 isn't a story heavy episode. The prophecy and what the Gothitelle said sound very story heavy. I'm guessing the part people might hate Ame for is the gym battle. 

2. It sounds like an endgame event. We're near the endgame, but we're not quite there yet. 

 

Ame said it's a straight shot from the 17th gym to the 18th, and also from the 18th gym to the Elite Four. If we assume Lin is the Champion now, I think this will happen as we're about to battle Lin after having defeated the E4. If Lin isn't the Champion, I think this will happen in the place with the long name where Arceus was supposedly born. I can't think of any other candidates for Champion besides Lin, but on the other hand I can't think of a place that makes more sense than the one with the long name...maybe E4 -> Lin goes to long name place -> it happens there and that's where our Champion/Lin battle takes place? (assuming I'm on the right track here to begin with. Maybe I'm completely off the mark)

 

The part about a wish reminds me that one of Shade's quotes in the online league was "She will wish for you". IIRC, he said this when he had one Pokemon left.

 

I vote for Ame's thread being next. 

 

@Zander I'm okay. There wasn't much damage to my area, and I got power back yesterday afternoon.