Help Choosing My 6th Team Member (Likely Defensive Water)/Final Tweaks

[afterthegame]

Hello,

 

From what I've seen, this is a pretty great community for helping out more casual players with the challenges that come with Reborn, so thanks in advance for any help you can give.  I've never done competitive battling or the like, but I'd like to think I've at least got a basic understanding of how to construct a decent team.  With that being said, I could definitely use some help filling out my last slot and making a viable, balanced team.  The one caveat (and the thing that makes this harder) is that I'm trying to do this only with pokemon that I've always liked the look of without using the cheat code that is Blaziken.

 

The team I'm currently building seems like it will probably work okay through the rest of the game, although it feels too sweeper heavy to fit well in the world of reborn.  Before I get too into the weeds on my thinking and potential solutions, I'll post my current team along with the move slots I'm struggling with.

 

Note: None of my pokemon are EV trained yet, although most have pretty good IVs.

 

Froslass (Lead)

-Level: 80

-Ability: Cursed Body

-Nature: Timid

-IVs: 18,18,20,30,25,29

-Held Item: Bright Powder (Focus Sash for Big Battle)

-Moves: Shadow Ball, Blizzard, Destiny Bond, Spikes

 

Serperior (Subseed Annoyer/Special Sweeper)

-Level: 80

-Ability: Contrary

-Nature: Timid

-IVs: 23,14,17,20,4,25

-Held Item: Leftovers

-Moves: Leech Seed, Substitute, Leaf Storm, Giga Drain (should I replace with Toxic? Something else? HP is ground, so not worth it IMO)

 

Metagross (Offensive Tank)

-Level: 64

-Ability: Clear Body

-Nature: Adamant

-IVs: 31,26,26,31,31,30 - that took forever with a ditto that has a 31 in SpA, a 26 in Def, and garbage everywhere else

-Held Item: Lucky Egg (Assault Vest eventually)

-Moves: Meteor Mash, Bullet Punch, Zen Hedbutt, Hammer Arm/Thunder Punch/Toxic/Pursuit

 

Tyrantrum (Wallbreaker)

-Level: 80

-Ability: Rock Head

-Nature: Jolly

-IVs: 31,30,26,31,28,31

-Held Item: Wide Lens (Choice Scarf/Choice Band Eventually)

-Moves: Head Smash, Dragon Claw, Earthquake, Zen Headbutt (I now regret not breeding on one of the fang moves, but I thought I could get Superpower at the time)

 

Bisharp (Revenge Killer/Physical Sweeper)

-Level: 60

-Ability: Defiant

-Nature: Adamant

-IVs: 30,31,26,13,28,31

-Held Item: Exp. Share/Scope Lens (Black Glasses/Life Orb Eventually)

-Moves: Sucker Punch, Night Slash (7th Street Bug so no Knock Off), Iron Head, Swords Dance/Stealth Rock/Low Sweep

 

In Rotation (all lvl 80):

Magnezone (timid/sturdy) - love it but prefer metagross especially with no volt switch

Gardevoir (docile-whoops/trace) - always seems to be my backup to every pokemon

Emboar (impish/reckless) - no will-o-wisp to make him the defensive juggernaut I wanted

Flygon (adamant/levitate) - duplicative to Tyrantrum

Empoleon (calm/torrent) - the worst moveset and why no steel moves?!

 

6th Spot:

 

Feraligatr (Physical Sweeper) - Issues: yet another physical attacker which makes my team all offensive all the time.

-Level: 65

-Ability: Sheer Force

-Nature: Jolly

-IVs: 31,31,26,1,30,30

-Held Item: Life Orb

-Moves: Waterfall, Dragon Dance, 2 of Crunch/Ice Punch/Superpower/Substitute

 

Milotic (Defensive) - Issues: with no Scald/Ice Beam TMs, I'm not even sure what moveset I'd run with this, possibly Toxic?

-Level: Theoretical

-Ability: Marvel Scale

-Nature: Bold

-IVs: Theoretical 

-Held Item: Leftovers

-Moves: Haze, Recover, ???

 

These two I just realized I could get now if I wanted, but I haven't done any of the catching/breeding.

 

Swampert (Defensive) 

-Level: Theoretical

-Ability: ???

-Nature: ???

-IVs: Theoretical 

-Held Item: Leftovers

-Moves: Stealth Rock, Earthquake, Surf/Muddy Water/???, Roar/Toxic/Protect

 

Slowbro/Slowking (Defensive) - Issues: I'm honestly not familiar with these guys as I've never used either one; however, they look like they'd be fun, still no Scald

-Level: Theoretical

-Ability: Regenerator

-Nature: Bold

-IVs: Theoretical 

-Held Item: Leftovers

-Moves: ???

 

Is there anything else I'm not thinking of that would fit well with this team/a Pokemon that I already have that could do the trick?  Mind you, I have no interest in Rotom, because as useful as it is, I just don't want an appliance in my team (no offense to Rotom lovers).  Any help is really appreciated, thanks!

[NickCrash]

Well, since Abilities and Nature can be changed, I don't think anyone paid attention. IV's matter little. At least less than Nature, EVs and Base stats.

It seems you took a lot of sets from Smogon, or at least checked what the tendencies for said mons are. Thing is, competitive works different. 

 

The changes I suggest for the pokemon you already have are:
1) Serperior: Give it HP-Ground. If you played competitively, you'd know how useful that can be (most common: fire, second best: ground). In my opinion you should either get rid of Leech seed or Substitute. You seem to prefer playing very offensively so tactics with toxic/sub/wish etc won't really work. Naturally, going offensively in campaign-mode is the fastest way to complete any pokemon game, but you are trying to balance the movesets without using more defensive pokemon and this might lead to problems. Remove Substitute and try to use Leech Seed for tankier foes that your other members can deal with, or to hit something in doubles.

2) Frosslass: Try giving it Confuse Ray instead of Spikes. They aren't that useful in campaign. 

3) Metagross: Definitely give it Thunder Punch, unless you are willing to train an electric type faster than Magnezone. In that case, Hammer Arm seems okay.

 

Possible Additions:
1) Slowbro: Great pokemon, and quite balanced. With a moveset of Surf / Psyshock / Calm Mind / filler move (usually reserved for Ice Beam or Fire Blast) you are covered in more ways than one. I highly recommend it over Milotic and Swampert, mainly because it can function without TMs just as well, and save you healing rounds simply by switching around.

2) Electivire: Much faster than Magnezone, electric immunity, and a good movepool to choose from. You have no electrics, which means you had to go through the trouble of passing the factory and short-circuit fields without exploiting them. Since you can get Elekid after Calcenon, give it a try. It can also learn Flamethrower, which will be handy for Titania.

3) Powerful Staraptor: I noticed you have nothing flying or levitating, and the fact that you are trying to cover up your defensive synergy with possible 4th moves shows you need more reliable members for your team. Since a physical bird with Intimidate can aleviate some of the more defensive problems you have, I think it's worth a shot. 

[T.O.W.A.N.]

Out of the four that you have picked, I would go with Feraligatr and Milotic. You already have two other psychics via metagross and gardevoir. Both Feraligatr and Milotic are good for different situations. But if you must choose only one, I would probably go for milotic. In many of the upcoming battles, milotic's ability, marvel scale, will be activated in several fields. For moves, I would go for surf, icy wind (ice beam isn't available yet, but it can be useful by providing speed control for your slower mons and gets a field boost in certain fields), recover, and haze/toxic. I would probably go for haze to make milotic more of a de-buffer and some bosses do carry full heals. 

 

Though that is not to say you should discard Feraligatr. It should be a good sweeper. Out of curiosity, what is the OT for your Feraligatr? 

 

Now for the rest of your team: 

- Giga drain would be better for serperior than toxic. If not, then try running dragon pulse or nature power. 

- Ice punch would be more ideal for metagross. You already have a magnezone for electric attacks and an emboar for fighting moves. 

- You're better off teaching tyrantrum iron head over zen headbutt. It's more accurate and gives you type coverage against fairies. 

- Since you already have a bunch of sweepers, then try running stealth rocks on bisharp. 

- Keep a heart scale around for flygon. Come Gen 7, flygon gets dragon dance. Levitate is also a good ability since you have a few pokemon that are weak to ground.  

 

Hope this information helps. Take care?

[afterthegame]

4 hours ago, NickCrash said:

Well, since Abilities and Nature can be changed, I don't think anyone paid attention. IV's matter little. At least less than Nature, EVs and Base stats.

It seems you took a lot of sets from Smogon, or at least checked what the tendencies for said mons are. Thing is, competitive works different. 

 

The changes I suggest for the pokemon you already have are:
1) Serperior: Give it HP-Ground. If you played competitively, you'd know how useful that can be (most common: fire, second best: ground). In my opinion you should either get rid of Leech seed or Substitute. You seem to prefer playing very offensively so tactics with toxic/sub/wish etc won't really work. Naturally, going offensively in campaign-mode is the fastest way to complete any pokemon game, but you are trying to balance the movesets without using more defensive pokemon and this might lead to problems. Remove Substitute and try to use Leech Seed for tankier foes that your other members can deal with, or to hit something in doubles.

2) Frosslass: Try giving it Confuse Ray instead of Spikes. They aren't that useful in campaign. 

3) Metagross: Definitely give it Thunder Punch, unless you are willing to train an electric type faster than Magnezone. In that case, Hammer Arm seems okay.

 

Possible Additions:
1) Slowbro: Great pokemon, and quite balanced. With a moveset of Surf / Psyshock / Calm Mind / filler move (usually reserved for Ice Beam or Fire Blast) you are covered in more ways than one. I highly recommend it over Milotic and Swampert, mainly because it can function without TMs just as well, and save you healing rounds simply by switching around.

2) Electivire: Much faster than Magnezone, electric immunity, and a good movepool to choose from. You have no electrics, which means you had to go through the trouble of passing the factory and short-circuit fields without exploiting them. Since you can get Elekid after Calcenon, give it a try. It can also learn Flamethrower, which will be handy for Titania.

3) Powerful Staraptor: I noticed you have nothing flying or levitating, and the fact that you are trying to cover up your defensive synergy with possible 4th moves shows you need more reliable members for your team. Since a physical bird with Intimidate can aleviate some of the more defensive problems you have, I think it's worth a shot. 

Yeah, I've looked at Smogon for the ones I haven't used before, the others I just tried to figure out what would cover up the holes I made by purely trying to create a team full of pokemon I liked the looks of haha.

 

1. Thanks, I'll throw the HP ground on there, just wasn't sure since so many of my guys already had ground as a secondary attack.

 

Funny thing is, for most of the campaign it was a very defensive team built around stalling and roaring into hazards and stuff, as in most pokemon games I prefer a team that can heal itself so I never have to go into town/use items.  I think I beat most PULSE things and hard bosses with sub seed and the occasional destiny bond on my Gardevoir.  This team ended up so offensive purely because I like the looks of those guys and they happened to all be offensive which I realized 3/4 of the way through building the team.

 

2. Will do, I feel like I haven't used that much lately since I'm not using Roar and stacking poison and spikes anymore.

3. I was leaning that way, I just wasn't sure since I don't have a fighting 'mon, which is usually one of the types I like best.

 

Additions:

1) That was the main draw for me, as my previous campaign I had a regenerator tangrowth that was honestly my favorite guy in my previous campaign before I decided using Blaziken made the game too easy, even though he's one of my favorite looking pokemon after Talonflame and Gyarados.

2) Yeah, I still find myself using Magnezone in a ton of situations, so he subs in for one of the other Steel types pretty frequently

3) I actually thought about using him before, I'll take a look for sure.

[afterthegame]

3 hours ago, Hooligan said:

I'd use Metagross for the next two Gyms. Not just because it's my favorite Pokemon, but also it would have a nice use of its movepool. I'd recommend Bulldoze/Brick Break for the Titania's Gym, but when it comes to Amaria's Gym, I'd suggest Thunder Punch. Also, never use Bulldoze in Amaria's Gym, because it won't hit a thing in a Ocean-like Gym field. Also, for the Water Gym, I'd suggest swapping your Emboar for the Serperior and teach it Dragon Pulse instead of Substitute. You can use Leaf Storm from one to three times to boost Giga Drain and Dragon Pulse power, since it have Contrary. Don't use Serperior in Steel Gym, though. Slowbro have no use yet, because there is no Calm Mind if I recall correctly.

 

Also, Ame will fix the 7th Street move tutor glitch. I wanted to teach two of these moves for my Perfect IVs Hooligan Scrafty.

By any chance, don't you have a Beldum from OT Flingang? Because its IVs look like some of my early Beldum's Breeding. Now that I've got a 2 IVs Ditto, my goal is trying to breed 5 or 6 IVs Beldum.

 

Sorry for the last words being a bit off-topic, but I hope you find it useful. Take care.

Yeah Metagross is one of my top 5 favorite pokemon for looks, and the fact that he's useful and actually in the game is just gravy.  Cool I'll switch his moves around, shouldn't be hard since I have a million heart scales to retrain moves as necessary.

 

I'll probably train one up just to see how I like him on my team, but with him being that slow and my team generally being fast, those boosts do feel pretty important.

 

I do not, that is the result of way too many hours of breeding my 1 good stat beldum with 1.5 good stats ditto, before calling him good enough haha.  Good luck with your own Metagross adventures!

[afterthegame]

4 hours ago, T.O.W.A.N. said:

Out of the four that you have picked, I would go with Feraligatr and Milotic. You already have two other psychics via metagross and gardevoir. Both Feraligatr and Milotic are good for different situations. But if you must choose only one, I would probably go for milotic. In many of the upcoming battles, milotic's ability, marvel scale, will be activated in several fields. For moves, I would go for surf, icy wind (ice beam isn't available yet, but it can be useful by providing speed control for your slower mons and gets a field boost in certain fields), recover, and haze/toxic. I would probably go for haze to make milotic more of a de-buffer and some bosses do carry full heals. 

 

Though that is not to say you should discard Feraligatr. It should be a good sweeper. Out of curiosity, what is the OT for your Feraligatr? 

 

Now for the rest of your team: 

- Giga drain would be better for serperior than toxic. If not, then try running dragon pulse or nature power. 

- Ice punch would be more ideal for metagross. You already have a magnezone for electric attacks and an emboar for fighting moves. 

- You're better off teaching tyrantrum iron head over zen headbutt. It's more accurate and gives you type coverage against fairies. 

- Since you already have a bunch of sweepers, then try running stealth rocks on bisharp. 

- Keep a heart scale around for flygon. Come Gen 7, flygon gets dragon dance. Levitate is also a good ability since you have a few pokemon that are weak to ground.  

 

Hope this information helps. Take care?

I'll definitely take a look at Milotic as well then, since that's honestly the one I was originally most excited to try as I've never used it before.  Icy wind isn't bad to ensure I can outspeed some people since my team has gotten slower and started hitting harder as the game has gone on.

 

Feraligatr is mine, caught him with terrible IVs and yet again spent too much time breeding only to realize he took my team to over the top offensive.

 

-Giga drain is my favorite move, which is why I haven't gotten rid of it, even if it makes him a Grass-only mon

-The only reason I wasn't doing that is my main team doesn't usually carry either of those guys, although they rotate in a lot

-Yeah, I would do that if I had the move tutor to allow it.

-Cool, thanks I'll keep stealth rock on him then.

-Heart scales I have about 80 of, I just kept using theif to kill Luvdiscs while trying to complete the Wishcash event.

 

That was all super helpful, thanks!

[Wolfox]

it's a good thing to have both Gardevoir and Magnezone on rotation, as @Zarc would also say, those two are an almost unbeqatable core. as for a Water Type... Milotic is the only one I can recomend, as it's one of the only bulky water types that I don't wanna see burning to death (I kinda really hate water mons, specifically stall water mons...)

[Zargerth]

If it's defensive Water -types you're looking for, how about Vaporeon or Gastrodon? While the lack of Scald holds them back, they both have access to recovery moves like Wish and Recover respectively. Then you could run Toxic (and maybe Acid Armor too). Last moveslot would be STAB, like Surf or Hydro Pump.

[guidy]

I am surprised no one really mentions Swampert. The next gym will be (if not confirmed, most likely) Titiania and thus steel type.
Looking at your main team right now, it's gonna be a bit hard. Tytantrum and Froslass are at a disadvantage and Serperior doesn't do much on steel types either.
I have a run with Swampert, including EQ and Waterfall. He is one of the MVP in the team and I personally would highly recommend Swampert. 
I don't know what other moves I have on Swampert right now, but using some moves like Ice Punch/Stealth Rocks/Stone Edge would be my advise.
Not sure if he has the BEST defences, but his only real threat is grass (for which you can use ice punch), so it's pretty flexible in use.
His only downside is speed, but maybe you can scarf Swampert or think of something else.

[afterthegame]

2 hours ago, Zargerth said:

If it's defensive Water -types you're looking for, how about Vaporeon or Gastrodon? While the lack of Scald holds them back, they both have access to recovery moves like Wish and Recover respectively. Then you could run Toxic (and maybe Acid Armor too). Last moveslot would be STAB, like Surf or Hydro Pump.

Vaporeon was actually one I've seen my buddy use competitively to great effect, I just wasn't sure how viable it would be without Scald to pass burns, I may breed for a wish just to see how it looks.

[afterthegame]

Also FWIW, it doesn't need to be a water type as @NickCrash pointed out.  My team as it stands has a big problem with Fire and a fairly rough time with Ground as well, so water seemed like the best bet without opening myself up to a bigger weakness to fighting or anything else.

 

I'm currently leaning slightly towards Slowbro with Regenerator, even though that opens me up to some fairly bad weaknesses to Ghost and especially Dark because it also gives me access to a powerful Fire move, even without STAB.  Would Alomomola fit into this team well, or would it be way too defensive for the rest of my core?

Edited October 12, 2017 by afterthegame
additional clarification

[NickCrash]

Try editing your posts instead of multi-posting. It makes it much easier to read.