The Political Soap Box

[Duster]

Has anyone seen that Darren Wilson has reportedly received injuries, including an optical fracture and a few other bruises, to suggest violence before the shooting?

I saw it on Fox, but I don't trust any news reports, especially when this issue is so heavily influenced by race and political sides.

Seems to me just like another classic political conflict, everyone is at fault no matter which way you slice it.

[Deleted User]

All eyewitness accounts however limited they may be, tell a different story, the government and media is just building up a counter story to protect their image.

The police arm just as armed as the military is in IRAQ, plenty of gadgets and gizmos, now all they need is the gunner on the top and you got yourself a full ready to go Military vehicle. (Hence militarization). Why do we need this against our own people? People are forming roadblocks for peaceful protest far more often than to loot or cause violence. Keep the police safe? So that's why they keep going on the offensive? You keep drinking that kool aid Godot. Maybe someday you'll wake up and realize that America is corrupt too.

[Maelstrom]

You do realize the only additions to that truck are platforms on the sides and top where the cops can stand/ride. Oh so scary that more of them can hang on like a dude riding trolley or they now have a platform from which to have a better vantage or speak out to crowds.

Like chickens with their heads cut off for no reason. The paranoia is real guys.

The police are just as armed as the army. Where are my rocket launchers and recoilless rifles? Where are my heavy machine guns and automatic rifles? Where are my attack choppers and shinooks? WWhere are my grenade launchers.

II take it none of you have stopped to think how they do pretty much the same things. Enter and clear rooms that may or may not contain armed hostiles. Patrol the streets and enforce order where there is always a chance of getting shot at.

You know what those gadgets are? GPS, radios, multitools. Crowd control- rubber bullets, bean bag launchers, CS gas, flash bangs, batons, cuffs, shields, tazers. All that stuff to keep people and officers at a safe distance from one another and failing that, nonlethal methods of halting and restraining people. Because if you can't stay behind the lines where you're allowed to protest and approach the cops, you think they're going to believe you have good intentions? You forget how dynamic and dangerous groupthink is. you forget the massive soccer stadium fights. you forget student riots that escalate into looting and property damage, like flipped cars.

[Godot]

Student riots? Like that guard station that got trashed? Or the random ass civil rights parades that keep me and several others from performing everyday essential life things? Or all these posters and cars and trucks that are still driving around today telling us that all cops are blood thirsty killers?

I must be blind! I need to see the light! Or start watching Fox News.

Also, blocking roads for peaceful protests? That isn't peaceful protest. That is grade A. Bullshit. If I wasn't with my grandparents at the time, I would have ran those dumb asses over. In a way. The cops are protecting these dumb ass protesters from Blunt and Sarcastic realists like myself.

Also, I do know America is corrupt. Every country and business organization in the whole damn world is corrupt. It is just that they are corrupt in ways that I don't give a crap about.

Also, this crap going on in Fergison isn't news. That place was already crap before it hit the news. The real issue is that the ignorant are being given knowledge that they don't know how to use or handle. And fun fact! Things along this nature happen all the fucking time. I keep bringing up events that you guys don't know too much about because this crap all happens all the time actually. I just keep mentioning the particular instances that happened locally. I am just kinda surprised that Erick doesn't know about some of the events I mentioned. Mael knew about them and he hasn't been in the area in years.

[Maelstrom]

I just happened to see the video on CNN of the hobo getting hit by the bean bag guns because he was holding a small camping knife after he agreed to leave. And then they sent the dog on him, to make sure he was disarmed I think.

Actually, I'll just link you to the video. I think it IS police brutality in this one, borne of police cowardice. The force used was definitely disproportional to the threat presented. You can try to evaluate the info in the rest of the video about other incidents.

http://www.cnn.com/video/?/video/crime/2014/06/19/erin-dnt-griffin-new-mexico-police-killings.cnn&iref=allsearch&video_referrer=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.cnn.com%2Fsearch%2F%3Fquery%3Dalbuquerque%26x%3D0%26y%3D0%26primaryType%3Dmixed%26sortBy%3Drelevance%26intl%3Dfalse

[Godot]

Oh, so a dog killed him? Didn't know that part. All I know is that the hobo refused to leave and attacked first. And the posters I read worded it like he was just simply camping, like with a tent and roasting Marshmallows.

I believe the exact phrase they used was;

"An in innocent man was gunned down for "Illegally Camping"."

[Gyaradoskiller]

Has anyone seen that Darren Wilson has reportedly received injuries, including an optical fracture and a few other bruises, to suggest violence before the shooting?

I saw it on Fox, but I don't trust any news reports, especially when this issue is so heavily influenced by race and political sides.

Seems to me just like another classic political conflict, everyone is at fault no matter which way you slice it.

>Fox News

No. Get out. Just no. You do not trust Fox News at all.

[The Fush]

>Fox News

No. Get out. Just no. You do not trust Fox News at all.

I don't think that comment was necessary when he basically said the same thing himself.

While I do understand that there's more than one side to the whole story, it is undeniable that the shooting of Brown and some of the subsequent events that have followed are influenced heavily by racism on blacks.

[Neo]

Student riots? Like that guard station that got trashed? Or the random ass civil rights parades that keep me and several others from performing everyday essential life things? Or all these posters and cars and trucks that are still driving around today telling us that all cops are blood thirsty killers?

I must be blind! I need to see the light! Or start watching Fox News.

Also, blocking roads for peaceful protests? That isn't peaceful protest. That is grade A. Bullshit. If I wasn't with my grandparents at the time, I would have ran those dumb asses over. In a way. The cops are protecting these dumb ass protesters from Blunt and Sarcastic realists like myself.

Also, I do know America is corrupt. Every country and business organization in the whole damn world is corrupt. It is just that they are corrupt in ways that I don't give a crap about.

Also, this crap going on in Fergison isn't news. That place was already crap before it hit the news. The real issue is that the ignorant are being given knowledge that they don't know how to use or handle. And fun fact! Things along this nature happen all the fucking time. I keep bringing up events that you guys don't know too much about because this crap all happens all the time actually. I just keep mentioning the particular instances that happened locally. I am just kinda surprised that Erick doesn't know about some of the events I mentioned. Mael knew about them and he hasn't been in the area in years.

Nah, b. I keep up with all sorts of shit, it just wasn't 100% relevant to the discussion at hand, that being increased militarization of police and the problems it poses to citizens.

The shit that goes down with cops getting away with killing innocent people whether they be black, mexican, asian, or white pisses me off.

[Gyaradoskiller]

I don't think that comment was necessary when he basically said the same thing himself.

I just noticed it right now. I had actually misread any as many. Sorry Duster.

[Godot]

@erick. Not all of them do. It is how people react to it that pisses me off.

Sometimes it is depressing to hear that high school never ends.

[Neo]

I encourage y'all to watch this interview with Killer Mike. He raises some very good points relating to the discussion that's occurred over the last few pages.

[Deleted User]

http://www.addictinginfo.org/2014/08/20/fake-injury-ferguson/

[Gyaradoskiller]

Here's more

Edited August 22, 2014 by Gyaradoskiller

[Maelstrom]

The thing is, saying 'everyone is at fault' is not enough. When it comes to justice and the legal system, you have to do the hard job of determining who is at fault for what and by how much. "I don't care who started it is a response used by parents. WWho started something is a huge thing in court. These reasons are why people get paid the big bucks.

[The Fush]

The thing is, saying 'everyone is at fault' is not enough. When it comes to justice and the legal system, you have to do the hard job of determining who is at fault for what and by how much. "I don't care who started it is a response used by parents. WWho started something is a huge thing in court. These reasons are why people get paid the big bucks.

I don't know about you, but the violation of basic human rights due to racism and the injuring and killing of protestors, be they rioters or not, aswell as the fear induced by the police's tactics and the legal rules they've broke by removing their badges and any identity to them, makes the police here far more at fault than any bullshit the other side's done to them so far.

[Maelstrom]

Assuming it's racism and not just anger or misjudgement.

One does not fear the police if one is constantly pushing the safe boundaries that have been set. It is only ignorance and deliberately choosing to see what they want to see when they see gear. Gear is protective or productive, and distinctive from the actual weapons they carry, which is what they have traditionally carried, shotguns and pistols and rifles. Not much has actually changed other than appearance.

Also, by violating lawful boundaries, they forfeit certain basic rights, such as freedom (ie, they detained/arrested). and if you think crowd control techniques such as gas is unlawful, think again. but they will be held accountable for the decision of when and where to use it.

[Gyaradoskiller]

Here's a good article to read.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/michael-skolnik/unarmed-white-why-i-wont-_b_5696099.html

Edited August 22, 2014 by Gyaradoskiller

[Godot]

I don't know about you, but the violation of basic human rights due to racism and the injuring and killing of protestors, be they rioters or not, aswell as the fear induced by the police's tactics and the legal rules they've broke by removing their badges and any identity to them, makes the police here far more at fault than any bullshit the other side's done to them so far.

1. You have the right to do whatever it takes to restrain them if they break the law.

From what I have been reading, a lot of you guys believe that it is wrong to take action against a groups of civilians gone wild causing harm for others. I am sorry, but if you perform inhuman actions such as becoming a human road block, trashing guard stations that don't actually have anything to do with the police, or do anything else along those lines to "prove a point". You forfeit your rights for humanity. Same could be said about server trolls or rule breakers. If you break a rule or a law in this case, we can do whatever it takes to restrain you.

2. Killing of protesters? That is a new one. Now that idiot shoplifter is a protester? What was he protesting? His lack of smokes? His right to treat others how he wanted to be treated? His right to refuse arrest? His right to bear arms that don't rightfully belong to him?

HOW DARE THEY OBJECT TO HIS RIGHTS!!!

3. Using or inducing fear tactics? What is wrong with that? No seriously, can someone explain to me what is wrong with that? That is a basic principle of authority IMO.

4. Removing Badges;

Okay there are some things wrong on their end of this, but considering the fact that people are bat shit crazy. Some law Enforcement/ military forces are not allowed to wear badges to conceal their identity. There isn't actually that much illegal allowed involving it.

I would love to explain why, but Mael already did a few posts ago if you have actually been reading what he and I have been saying.

In case you haven't.... Here is a short summary; protection of friends, family, and self.

These cops who are restraining these rebels all have lives outside of their jobs. And these rebels are idiots so if they discover the identity of some of these cops, they can and will come after their friends, family or the officers themselves when they are off the clock.

5. A few posts ago reguarding the truck. jerico mentioned something about adding a minigun on top of the police escort vehicle. Where the hell did you get that idea? That right there proved that you have absolutely no grasp of the situation at hand. I can't take you seriously anymore after that...

6. And I had a conversation with someone the day I first hear about the Fergison incident revolving skin color. If this kid was white. It would have changed the case entirely.

Long story short the same incident would still happen despite his color of skin. The part involving the cop all started with the cop telling the victim "be careful" because he was jaywalking. He would have done that no matter what you looked like.

However. If this victim was white instead of black... This cop would have been in deeper shit than he already is. There would be more riots and protests than what we are getting right now. On top of all that, the media would have been playing the "innocent" card a lot more often. Because white people never do anything wrong! They are white! They are the color of purity!

[Chevaleresse]

Zagan that last part is bullshit and you know that. If anything, this whole mess is worse BECAUSE he was black, because no one cares if white people are discriminated against. I was with you the entire way until you said that. The guy was black so the cops were accused of racism, which is an extremely heated issue, so people escalated it from perceived police brutality to a perceived hate crime by an authority figure.

[Neo]

There wouldn't be riots because the cop would've been arrested. But because it's a black child that was killed, people fish for all kinds of excuses. 'He was a thug' 'He's from the ghetto anyway' 'He would've committed a crime anyway.' That's the problem.

[Godot]

There wouldn't be riots because the cop would've been arrested. But because it's a black child that was killed, people fish for all kinds of excuses. 'He was a thug' 'He's from the ghetto anyway' 'He would've committed a crime anyway.' That's the problem.

I get where you are coming from. I am just saying that the riots would have started whether this guy was black or white. It happened here I. Albuquerque where over half the population is colored,". Race was also not mentioned in the incidents that caused the riots here.

One thing you forgot is that this kid DID commit a crime, 3 infact. Or 2 and a half.

1. He committed robbery.

2. He resisted arrest

1/5. This one is the most debated one, but he apparently attacked a cop. This one I am willing not to count, because a lot of you believe that the cop was not assaulted.

Lastly this is how the incident was publicly announced " a young black teenager was gunned down by a cop."

If he was white it would have sounded like this " an innocent young man was gunned down by a corrupt cop."

[The Fush]

2. Killing of protesters? That is a new one. Now that idiot shoplifter is a protester? What was he protesting? His lack of smokes? His right to treat others how he wanted to be treated? His right to refuse arrest? His right to bear arms that don't rightfully belong to him?

HOW DARE THEY OBJECT TO HIS RIGHTS!!!

I don't think I'm going to bother continuing this argument until you actually read my wording with a clear mind.

[Chevaleresse]

I maintain that if it was some white kid, absolutely nothing would have happened other than grumbling about police brutality. Instead, the guy was black, so instantly racism comes up as a reason for the death, and you get the massive shitstorm that's happening right now because people get so worked up over race that they don't bother to check the facts.

[Maelstrom]

Always challenge the initial assumption, especially when you go on to look at it and see how few details are actually provided. From the start, the story was reported with a slant to it and people were very eager to roll with that slant. Then you get a group of angry people together and they rile each other up into a riot. Really, the whole situation has been counterproductive for both sides.

Gotta think about those businesses were hurt because protesters weren't working because they were there, businesses hurt because maybe the protests and riots kept customers away from the area, and the obvious hurt from looters breaking into shit. Slow reaction by officials/elected leadership to curb the behavior of some obviously upset, undisciplined officers has really made this ordeal last much longer than it should have. Not to mention slanted twitters and snapchats and shit that riled even more people up. Like all those videos of the police reacting and maybe a mention here or there of what they were actually reacting to.