49th Parallel Posted November 23, 2012 Share Posted November 23, 2012 (edited) Hey, welcome to my second RMT on these forums, thanks for clicking :] If you don't know me, much less remember me, it's understandable, as my activity on the server is spotted at best, coming on very rarely and for limited periods of time due to shaky internet connection. That being said, when I do go on, this is the team I use. Having fooled around with this and that for some time, I decided to make a team that could take advantage of the currently presented metagame and format. After a fair amount of testing, I reached what you see today. This team is a Hyper Offensive Rain team, showcasing the painfully underused Deoxys-S' ability to set hazards effectively early-game, as well as a Double Dragon-esque SS core of Ludicolo and Kingdra. While many aspects of this team retain many standard elements, the use of some unorthodox choices allows me to keep the opponent on their toes, even after "revealing" my 'mons and sets. This team has performed admirably for me, easily allowing me to jump to the upper reaches of the leaderboard every time I ladder, and while that certainly doesn't mean much when all is said and done (it's just a number on a board in a Pokemon server ), I believe it proves the team's effectiveness as a whole. While I'm not retiring this team per say, my limited activity makes the idea of "losing surprise value" a moot point, so I might as well get some input on it :] I decided to dedicate this team to the album of the same name, as it's fast-paced and eclectic nature seemed to perfectly denote the nature of this team. That being said, allow me to introduce the team! Deoxys-S | Rocky Helmet***Before I Wake Trait | Timid EVs | 252 HP / 124 Def / 60 SpD / 72 Spe Nature | Timid Stealth Rock Spikes Taunt Thunderbolt Role: It can be said that Deoxy-S is single-handedly the most efficient layer of early-game entry hazards in the game. That being said, Deoxys-S was a natural pick for my team, being able to not only set up 2+ layers of hazards in an average match, but even spreading around some easy residual damage with Rock Helmet. This allows me to punish Volt-Turn without even doing anything, as well as netting some essential damage on support Tyranitar as they Pursuit. This can also help against Rapid Spin users who attempt to spin from the get-go, forcing them to rack up residual damage as they spin and eventually building up a cycle in which I can favourably come in with Chandelure and trap them outright. It's bulk is also quite nice, and usually underestimated by opponents expecting to just pick it off with 2 Politoed Scalds or something along those lines, letting me get up an extra layer almost for free. Moveset, EVs, and Nature: The moveset I find to be rather self-explanatory, with Stealth Rock and Spikes being the optimal hazards for an offensively paced team, and Taunt preventing opponent's from setting up on it. The last slot is rather niche, and isn't used much anyway. However Thunderbolt allows Deoxys-S to hit annoying Xatu that try to prevent my hazards, while also hitting Water-type spinners that annoy Chandelure hard. The EV spread is intended to maximize overall bulk, allowing it to consistently take Specs Politoed's Hydro Pump (as well as 2 defensive 'Toed's Scald's), take Ttar Pursuit's and such better, and give Genesect the SpA boost, preventing it from U-Turning out for heavy damage. 60 Speed EVs and a Timid Nature allows Deoxys-S to outpace everything from Adamant +1 Garchomp down, allowing me to set up an extra layer in their faces. "Tomorrow everything will change Today will never seem the same So I will try to find a way To say everything I need to say And If I should die before I wake Remember everything we said today" Politoed | Leftovers***Suburban Doxology Trait | Drizzle EVs | 252 HP / 204 Def / 12 SpA / 40 Spe Nature | Bold Scald Perish Song Ice Beam Protect Role: Politoed's first and foremost role in this team is to set up Rain. From there, he's a utility. Someone's running Baton Pass? Send out 'Toed to scout for Mr.Mime and break the chain. Need to sponge a Kingdra Draco Meteor? 'Toed can take on real quick. Essentially Politoed serves this team as a defensive pivot and utility counter for the occurrences when I lose offensive momentum. Of course it has to be played more carefully in the instance of winning weather wars, but usually the combination of entry hazards and Chandelure can efficiently remove opposing weather conditions without much hassle. Moreover, it's ability to "break even" with opposing bulky Water-types is quite nice, as many players with leave their bulky Waters in on 'Toed to wear him down, and in return I get to push extra damage and Scald burns onto them, alleviating pressure on Kingdra, Chandelure, and Terrakion. Moveset, EVs, and Nature: The moveset isn't too far-fetched, all being fairly standard of a defensive Politoed. I run Ice Beam over Toxic to ensure more direct damage on Grass- and Dragon-types, which can force Recovers from stuff like Celebi and Lati@s, allowing me to get a safe switch to the appropriate 'mon. The EVs, alongside a Bold nature, maximize physical bulk, with enough Speed to outpace most Scizor and CBtar, and a few EVs in SpA to guarantee Scald to OHKO Chandelure after SR. "'Cause I can't change the way I see the world I stand up and fight for what I don't deserve I know I can't justify my reasons Just tell me the way I ought to feel What's right and wrong, and what you think is real And I'll try to amplify my irony" Chandelure | Choice Scarf***cRaZieS Trait | Shadow Tag EVs | 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe Nature | Timid Fire Blast Shadow Ball Trick Curse Role: I'm going to go out on a limb here and say that Chandelure is one of the best 'mons in the tier. It's ability to trap and beat such an extensive amount of 'mons depending on what set it uses, backed by the lack of Team Preview to properly predict it, Chandelure can fit onto almost any team. However, some people may question the use of it, a Fire-type, on a Rain team. Let me say that if anything, this point makes Chandelure more effective, with fewer people expecting it. Chandelure serves to trap problematic Pokemon before they can do much, including (but not limited to) Ferrothorn, Ninetales, physically defensive Hippowdon (under 65%), Abomasnow, Celebi, Chansey/Blissey, and Lati@s. Of course, it also doubles as a spin-blocker, preventing the hazards set by Deoxys-S from being removed. This forms an excellent synergy, with Deoxys-S setting hazards, and Chandelure protecting the hazards and in turn eliminating the spinners without much hassle. Moveset, EVs, and Nature: The moveset is definitely less than orthodox, so allow me to explain. While my team needs the speed of Choice Scarf to accomplish some KO's, such as that of Lati@s and Starmie, I found coverage moves beyond it's STAB irrelevant, as Pokemon such as Tyranitar and Heatran were already threatened by the entirety of my remaining team. That said, I came up with this. Trick+Curse, in addition to allowing Chandelure to cripple Tentacruel and other irritating walls, allowed Chandelure the added benefit of being able to overcome Chansey / Blissey, crippling them a Scarf and proceeding to wittle them down with Curse. The EVs are straightforward, maximizing offensive presence and giving Genesect an Attack boost. I run Timid over Modest because the extra power is often rather unneeded, and being able to confidently outpace opposing Chandelure and other such Base 80 'mons is nice. "Whooa-o-o There's a body on the floor And the crazies, the crazies are coming to life Whooa-o-o I can't take it anymore 'Cause they're crazy, they're crazy But maybe they're right" Ludicolo | Life Orb***Don't You? Trait | Swift Swim EVs | 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe Nature | Modest Hydro Pump Giga Drain Ice Beam Substitute Role: Part 1 of my Swift Swim "core", Ludicolo is a monster. Amazing coverage, solid Special Attack, and solid bulk to back it up, Ludicolo can easily clean through a multitude of teams on Spikes support alone. His Grass subtyping is invaluable to my team, allowing to bust through bulky Waters that may otherwise prove problematic to the team. Usually I play Ludicolo rather aggressively, using him to smash stuff and wear down Kingdra's check for it to come in and clean up later (thus the Double Dragon analogy). If that's what goes down, I'm either luring in Chansey, Blissey, Ferrrothorn, etc. to be trapped by Chandelure, I'm wearing down all the generally bulky 'mons for Kingdra later, or I'm straight sweeping. Giga Drain is also huge, preventing him from being casually LO stalled by anyone with a flexible enough defensive core. Moveset, EVs, and Nature: The moveset is fairly standard of Ludicolo, with Hydro Pump being a necessity to mitigate Ludicolo's somewhat middling natural Special Attack and pushing KOs. The only differing trait would be the final move, Substitute. Personally, I found that every other "filler" move was worthless, so I decided upon trying Substitute and it was beautiful. Not only did it accomplish the usual reduction of prediction and easing of pressure on Hydro Pump hitting, but it allowed Ludicolo the ability to avoid Scald burns and Toxic's from bulky Water-types, greatly increasing it's longevity overall. I run max Speed and Special Attack to hit as hard and fast as possible, not wanting to play games with speed creep. "Don't you? Don't you want to be famous? Buy things like you don't even care Don't you? Don't you want to be famous? And everywhere you go have everybody stop and stare" Kingdra | Life Orb***Fight For You Trait | Swift Swim EVs | 4 Atk / 248 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe Nature | Modest Surf Draco Meteor Dragon Pulse Outrage Role: Kingdra is debatably the best Swift Swim sweeper in the game. Solid stats across the board, backed by excellent typing making Kingdra a versatile and powerful threat. Considering Ludicolo's impeccable ability to wear down bulky Water-types and Ferrothorn that would otherwise check Kingdra nicely, it can often clean through teams without much effort. It's Dragon STAB is a blessing to Rain teams, allowing it to break through opposing Dragon-types with much more ease than other Swift Swim users, who can often take a non-STAB Ice Beam barring a quad weakness. Moveset, EVs, and Nature: The moveset is strange-ish, but it functions quite well. Surf and Dragon Pulse offer consistent and reliable STAB attacks for Kingdra to spam late-game. Draco Meteor offers a nuke button for dishing out that extra damage to whatever needs to be hit hard. Lastly, Outrage offers a solid attack for netting that KO on a dedicated special wall such as Blissey after wearing it down a bit. The EV spread, coupled with a Modest nature, maximize it's offensive presence, while giving Genesect an Attack boost. While this does decrease the power of Outrage slightly, compromising Kingdra's overall bulk really isn't worth the extra power, especially when it already achieves all the damage I could really ask of it. The additional 4 EVs in Attack guarantee Outrage to OHKO 252 HP Latias after SR damage. "So we stand back to back and we smile as they come Cause they plan for attack Knowing we've already won" Terrakion | Lum Berry***My Way Trait | Justified EVs | 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe Nature | Adamant Swords Dance Rock Polish Close Combat Stone Edge Role: Terrakion serves this team as a multi-purpose tool. First and fore-mostly, Terrakion helps in breaking down dedicated special walls such as Chansey and Blissey, forcing them out and stacking residual damage on them with hazards. Of course, everyone understands the concept of Double Dance Terrakion, using the respective boost to smash either offensive or defensive teams. Of course, this is where the beauty of the team comes into play. What are the primary offensive checks to a +2 Terrakion? Techniloom and Scizor, no? Both get trapped and KO'ed by Chandelure if they try, or worse, one of the Swift Swimmers get in for free. Defensive responses? Gliscor, Hippowdon, maybe Skarmory? Sound like a bunch of free switches for my Swift Swin 'mons. Whether it's forcing the opponent into a tough position or just straight sweeping, Terrakion is always pulling his weight. Movesets, EVs, and Nature: The moveset is fairly straightforward considering the idea of Double Dance. The EV spread offers maximum offensive presence, while of course giving Genesect an Attack. Having used both Jolly and Adamant extensively, I've found Adamant to be more generally useful, allowing it to more effectively smash through teams (I don't risk Speed ties if at all possible anyway). "Everybody loves to tell me who and what to be More of what they always want and less and less of me I don't give a damn what they all say I'm not here to save the day I may lose it but I'll do it My Way" Importable: Deoxys-S @ Rocky Helmet Trait: Pressure EVs: 252 HP / 124 Def / 60 SDef / 72 Spd Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk) - Stealth Rock - Spikes - Taunt - Thunderbolt Chandelure (F) @ Choice Scarf Trait: Shadow Tag EVs: 252 SAtk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk) - Fire Blast - Shadow Ball - Trick - Curse Politoed (F) @ Leftovers Trait: Drizzle EVs: 252 HP / 204 Def / 12 SAtk / 40 Spd Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk) - Scald - Perish Song - Ice Beam - Protect Kingdra (M) @ Life Orb Trait: Swift Swim EVs: 4 Atk / 248 SAtk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd Modest Nature (+SAtk, -Atk) - Surf - Draco Meteor - Dragon Pulse - Outrage Ludicolo (F) @ Life Orb Trait: Swift Swim EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd Modest Nature (+SAtk, -Atk) - Hydro Pump - Giga Drain - Ice Beam - Substitute Terrakion @ Lum Berry Trait: Justified EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk) - Swords Dance - Rock Polish - Close Combat - Stone Edge Edited December 7, 2012 by 49th Parallel Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neo Posted November 23, 2012 Share Posted November 23, 2012 This team is amazing, as is the RMT. If you're ever on the server, I'd love to see it in action. When we do add a featured teams section, you can expect to see it in there. Rate: 10/10. Thank you for sharing it with us. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
diana Posted November 23, 2012 Share Posted November 23, 2012 This reminds me to do my own RMT Hoooly synergy. Everything just... I can't find any major flaws, besides the fact that it's weather, so it's a hit or miss startegy. But, 10/10, it's... to be blunt, fucking amazing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Melody Posted November 23, 2012 Share Posted November 23, 2012 Dang, This team is awesome. Barely any flaws and if some then merely minor... 10/10, Freaking genius. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wild Monkey Posted November 23, 2012 Share Posted November 23, 2012 Kaboom indeed! A very destructive force in my opinion! 10/10 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kamina Posted November 23, 2012 Share Posted November 23, 2012 yet another beutiful rmt (you gotta tell me your secret) though there are some nitpiks. for you defensive politoed i might recommend toxic instead of ice beam because if you see a grass pokemon i would not risk staying and icebeaming but instead i would switch immeadiately. Also with dragon pokes if they try and set up on politoed your parish song will already screw them over. Chandaleur set looks really weird though i guess in theory it might work. i preferably would go energy ball and hidden power ice to beat dragon types and ground pokes instead of trick and curse but that is just me kingdra - if you have it modest that why are you giving it a phisical move? no one is going to send a latios on a kingdra anyways. i might replace it with hydropump which is an option if you want to do a lot of damage to a poke that you are unsure you can KO or a hidden power to give it better coverage. other than that seems like a good team and very nice rmt format. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unknown Guy Posted November 23, 2012 Share Posted November 23, 2012 If You Use Rock Slide on Terrakion Then It Would be Good Because Stone Edge Miss Many Times.Stone Edge Has Less Accuracy and Rock Slide Has More Accuracy Then Stone Edge. And If You Use Energy ball On Chandelure instead of Curse Then Its very useful. i rate this team 7.5/10 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neo Posted November 23, 2012 Share Posted November 23, 2012 If You Use Rock Slide on Terrakion Then It Would be Good Because Stone Edge Miss Many Times.Stone Edge Has Less Accuracy and Rock Slide Has More Accuracy Then Stone Edge. And If You Use Energy ball On Chandelure instead of Curse Then Its very useful. i rate this team 7.5/10 Can I get a translator? I'm sure 49th has considered Rock Slide over Stone Edge, but the power gamble seems worth it imo. Also, did you not read Chandelure's description? He stated that Trick+Curse was used to cripple walls. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unknown Guy Posted November 23, 2012 Share Posted November 23, 2012 I cant speak english good so sorry about that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neo Posted November 23, 2012 Share Posted November 23, 2012 I would love to know the logic behind giving the team a 7.5/10. Care to share with us? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shanco Posted November 23, 2012 Share Posted November 23, 2012 And If You Use Energy ball On Chandelure instead of Curse Then Its very useful. Nah, I disagree. Looking at this set, Curse could be an interesting choice. I hope he doesn't mind me taking the team for a joyride and see how it plays out. Also, double stat up on Terrakion is...risky. You have five weakness which could all catch you off guard around every corner. I would recommend getting rid of Rock Polish in favor of something like Substitute, since it can't learn T-Wave like Cobalion. Thunderbolt on Deoxys is cool. But have you -- actually, you probably already tried Psycho Boost so meh. Other than that, yeah this team is boss, looks like. 9/10 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skwayz Posted November 23, 2012 Share Posted November 23, 2012 Hi. Dunno, this team looks good and stuff. I mean, double SS, a terrakion, a chandy, a bulky toed and a deo-s. I've seen that team like 99999x time early DW, but derp. Deo s idn't underated. Why would he be ? He was ban for a reason. It's not use here because no preview. Superpower over thunderbolt, that way you can OHKO those noobs that stay on ttar. Xatu isn't played in DW. Stall rip you appart with all those LO users. You can't really do something though, or it'd just break the synergy. If ferro manage to put SR on kingdra, well it'd just be a pain to deal with, even if chandy trap it after. Modest ludicolo is meh. Go with timid, or he'll just u-turn you to death. On terrakion, i'd go with subsalac. Double dance is really meh. It'd allow you to grab a sub on ttar, which is cool cuz brelooms are everywhere. ( for exemple, I run shel shell loom, and when chandy annoy me, I switch on ttar, then win). Chandy set looks cool but no HP ice is really a pain. I know you got ice beam toed for ddnite, but meh. Dunno. Stick with it if you like it. Overall, team is cool but I really don't like double SS. Smart sand player basically beat you, so does any hard stall player (they don't need to be smart lolol :lookatslant: ) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
49th Parallel Posted November 23, 2012 Author Share Posted November 23, 2012 So many comments Thanks guys, I appreciate all this! @Neo: Hey thanks man, that means a lot @Silver: I'm not a huge fan of weather myself tbh, but sometimes it's gotta be used Thanks @Light: Thanks :] @Wild Monkey: Thank ya @Berserker: Thanks man! I dunno about formatting and such, I just sorta start writing and see where it goes Anywho, I've used Toxic over Ice Beam a lot, and really it's almost entirely preference. At this stage Ice Beam is largely there to force Celebi, Lati@s, and such to Recover, giving me a free switch, while smacking Breloom and such on the switch. Toxic can usually accomplish the same, so it really could go either way Personally I was never a big fan of Chandy's coverage moves, which can really be seen in the set, but as stated prior it really helps with Chansey/Blissey. As far as Outrage on Kingdra goes, the 4th move is almost never used on special Kingdra I could run HP Fight for the extra damage on Ferrothorn, but then I'd be losing a Speed IV, and thus getting beaten by opposing Kingdra Plus, CM Latias is a pain for Rain teams as a whole, and if one switches in on a -2 Kingdra and starts CMing, I have to have Politoed at a good amount of HP to come in and Perish Song to stop it. I'd rather just have that extra assurance I guess haha. @Unknown Guy: Trust me, if I could afford the drop in power for acc. on Terrak, I would, my luck is terrible lol. Unfortunately, it really wants that extra power against stuff like Tentacruel, Jellicent, and so forth. As for the Chandy thing, I have found the utility of Curse (being able to safely force basically anything out, beating Bliss / Chan, forcing Tentacruel into a corner, etc.) to outweigh Energy Ball's immediate usage. If I was running Specs or something I would 100% use Energy Ball, but as is it doesn't amount to much from what I've seen :[ @rc52: I actually was playing with SubSalac Terrakion before changing over to Double Dance, and what brought me back to it was the extra Speed made available. While Substitute is a very nice balanced option for offensive and defensive teams alike, capping out at 519 Speed (post Salac use) was always annoying for it, being unable to outpace faster weather sweepers such as Kingdra and Excadrill. While this definitely makes him a little more susceptible to being checked by priority, he becomes thoroughly more useful once aforementioned priority has been removed. As for the use of Psycho Boost, I did try it out, and while I really like that it smashes Tentacruel (this team isn't a fan of Tenta ), the overall utility of Thunderbolt was somewhat more useful overall. I still use it sometimes though @Skwayz: I don't mean to come off as rude, but some of these comments really come across as odd to me :/ I say Deoxys-S is underrated because I've encountered him a grand total of 1 time in all of my time on this ladder lol. As for Xatu not being played, iirc Slant got #1 with a team that utilized physically defensive Xatu to block hazards, so it's not as though it doesn't exist. Targeting "noobs" that stay in with Tyranitar seems wasteful really, since I can usually get SR+2 layers of Spikes stacked up, while they get up SR and shave off around 18% off their HP from using Pursuit twice (factoring in Lefties). From there I can just go to 'Toed and force it out, at which point it will come in at about 50% next time it comes in. I also really don't understand the idea that stall "rips me apart" due to my LO users. From the matches I've had with stall, Terrakion has found multiple opportunities to set up an SD and smash through teams, and any stall teaming lacking Shed Shell Blissey (which I wouldn't call common lol) doesn't play around Ludicolo/Kingdra+Chandelure at all without making a few risky switches, something stall generally hates to do. In your statement suggesting Timid Ludicolo, who is the he that you state will just U-Turn out? Because the only thing I can think of in which this statement is applicable is Jolly non-Scarf Scizor out of Rain and Finneon lol. I understand your SubSalac suggestion, and I did explain why I used Double Dance over it in a reply. I understand that Breloom are quite common, and I myself run Shed Shell quite often on it, which is why usually Trick them if Ttar was already revealed. From there I can force them to Pursuit (SpDef variants only deal about 55% max when Chandy doesn't switch out), then Curse to force it out, getting back into Terrak, either managing to cripple the Tyranitar and deal big damage to the proceeding switch-in to Terrak or straight KOing Ttar and winning the weather war. It's not as though the whole process is black and white, it's a match between two people :x So I dunno how stall and "smart sand" auto-win against me :[ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skwayz Posted November 23, 2012 Share Posted November 23, 2012 Sorry if I my comments seems rude. Train was delayed and I just don't like RMT stuff with double SS. It's just too damn broken. Basically, if you kill ttar first turn, you win the game, with all those rain abuser. I'm not talking about reborn but DW in general (or BW before it was bannd). Deoxys was used. Slant was the only one using xatu competitivly. Again, I speak about DW in general, and xatu is under 2% usage iirc. And yeah derp, noob will stay on ttar. I didn't thought of that about chansey- my bad; but again, if ferro manage to put SR, you'll take lots of dammage from SR+LO. I'm talking obviously about scarf genesect, #2 most used pokemon. I got what you mean with double dance, I guess it's personal preference. Terrak under a sub is really a threat. Smart sand player will find a way to play around, and with SR and even one layer of spikes, your team will suffer a lot. (It's not autowin; but your team is overall frail, so if he manages to put SR and bring sand correctly by scouting with gene/rotom, it'll be hard for you to win.) Sorry if I was rude on my post, didn't mean to be. And again, i'm not english, so sometime I said thing that I shouldn't say ! If we could knew your Server name so we could play or something, it'd be cool. You look good (atleast better than other players here, derp) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fush Posted November 23, 2012 Share Posted November 23, 2012 This is one of the best teams I've seen in a long time. First of all, I love how you've managed to mix offense and defense together, primarily with your Deoxys-S and Politoed (good choice using Perish Song, by the way). Second of all... that synergy takes my breath away. Most of your pokemon can synergize with most of the others, and it brings more variable options to choose from when in a battle. Also, congratulations on having a team with 3 water types while only managing to have one electric weakness on it! It just works so well together. If we could knew your Server name so we could play or something, it'd be cool. You look good (atleast better than other players here, derp) Aaaaaaaand who might you be implying? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skwayz Posted November 23, 2012 Share Posted November 23, 2012 (edited) Hehe, Lots of ppl actually. But notya roo But huh, roo, it's absolutely not a defensive team, bulky toed is used here because it's needed and choice toed kinda shuck. Psong is the most common way to play it, so... And yeah it's easy to have 1 electric weakness with ludi and kingdra (badtroll) Btw, chandy set is lovely. I'd actually go Rain dance over outrage though. Being locked into outrage is one of the reason I just don't play DDance kingdra, that way you can surprise something on the switch, like Sdef ttar (even if he won't wanna switch on stab surf, it happen sometime.) Edited November 23, 2012 by Skwayz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lil' Baby Rupe Posted November 23, 2012 Share Posted November 23, 2012 (edited) Heya, nice team. I have a few suggestions; Politoed: Encore > Ice Beam The reasoning behind this is that Toed is coming in as a defensive pivot, usually against things that want to set up. A lot of people using dragons (which ice beam is used to counter) like to dragon-dance on the perish song/protect so they can get a free hit the following turn, so why not remove the possibility of this happening by hitting it with an encore, switch out, and gain momentum as their pokemon are trapped within a set-up move? Chandelure: Hidden Power [ice] > Curse I really don't see the point of Curse on this guy, to me it appears to be a wasted moveslot as you already have Trick to cripple certain walls. Sure, you may want to hit Curse on a last ditch effort at around 10% HP against their last pokemon, but the opportunities for Curse seem very situational. Hidden Power [ice], on the other hand allows you to take out dragons that have been encored by Toed, or walls such as Gliscor which might be a problem for Terrakion's sweep. I would also like to suggest Rain Dance > Substitute on Ludicolo. Having ran a set with Rain Dance, I can personally tell you that it can really save your life in certain situations. Rain Dance will give you an extra 5 turns of Rain which could be vital to finish a sweep late game, or to support Kingdra by sacking Ludi with a Rain Dance. It works wonders against opposing Ttar and Ninetails, catching them both off with a switch and putting your opponent in an awkward position. EDIT: turn the nature to TIMID on Ludicolo so he can outspeed scarf genesect (Seconding Skwayz's suggestion) I am personally a huge fan of SubSalac Terrakion. However, I have read your reasoning against using it, but I really think it suits the team a bit more than the double dance set and would definitely suggest a second try with this beast. I also want to second Skwayz suggestion of running Super Power > Thunderbolt on Deoxys-S for opposing Tyranitar leads which may be slightly more important to take out than, say, an extra spike. One last suggestion: Turn Kingdra into a specs set with the moves Surf/Draco Meteor/Dragon Pulse/ Sleep Talk or Ice Beam. This way you can switch into a spore and still fire off powerful moves, and imo Specs > LO (Another idea could be to swap his item for Chesto Berry and turn Outrage to Rest so you can pull off a sneaky late-game sweep) Not asking you to implement all the changes, but just things you can think about. Edit: I love the formatting for this RMT by the way. Edited November 23, 2012 by Rupe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slant Posted November 24, 2012 Share Posted November 24, 2012 Sup dude, Overall very solid rain offense! Politoed + Ludicolo + Kingdra is a tried-and-true formula, and it's always magical. Double dance Terrakion is cool too, having the option to plow through both offensive and defensive teams with the appropriate move. My main concern is with Chandelure. I must be missing something, cause I just don't get how it helps deal with the weather war. It can't really trap and kill opposing weather starters - ttar smacks it with pursuit/crunch/stone edge and ninetales is usually specially defensive, resists overheat, and can force it out with roar. What do you think about switching it with Dugtrio? This guy would function so much better than Chandelure at trapping and killing weather starters. You lose a spinblocker, but with such an offensive team your opponent won't have time to spin anyways. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
49th Parallel Posted December 7, 2012 Author Share Posted December 7, 2012 (edited) Wow, my internet connection is not my friend, sorry for taking forever in responding to stuff guys :[ @Skywayz: No problem man, I'd definitely agree Double SS is a paramount of this metagame (in fact, this team's concept was primarily a test of SS+Drizzle as a whole), and to be honest my reply shouldn't have been as hostile as it was, so I hope you can forgive me for that For some reason the whole time I was addressing your rate I was thinking of Ludi as a Base 75 Speed 'mon (don't ask why, I have no clue why), which is why I didn't think of Gene haha. That being said, I do like Timid, and it's definitely something I'll work with, though trading off the extra damage output v.stuff like Ferro and SpDef Celebi is a little annoying :[ I'll definitely try to get on the server sometime (internet/scholastic/awkward social life willing ), maybe even not use some weird alt .-. But yeahhhh, thanks for the input =) @Roo: Thanks man, I'm glad that you like it @Rupe: Hey man, thanks for the rate! I'm not gonna lie, I'm not a big a fan of Encore as whole, which I guess shows here Anywho, while I understand your reasoning behind Encore, Dragon Dancing Dragons (assuming you refer to Haxorus, DNite, and 'Mence) are all taking a hefty chunk from Ice Beam, either being flat OHKOed or 2HKOed, forcing them to attack or die off. That being said, as long as Kingdra is maintained, I can always just IBeam in those scenarios, sacccing 'Toed and RK'ing with Kingdra in a worst-case scenario. I also had used Rain Dance on both Ludicolo and Kingdra at a certain point in the team's history, and my rational behind dropping has been that I really haven't had much trouble winning weather wars lol. Almost every non-Politoed weather initiator is threatened by a 2HKO or better by every one of my sweepers, with the exceptions of Ludicolo v.Abomasnow and Terrakion v.Hippowdon, and coupled with the pressure entry hazards provide usually other weather teams have to play rather conservatively with their initiators to work around this and that. I'll definitely be testing Superpower on Deoxys-S and re-testing Terrak though, I do agree both are pretty chill options. @Slant: I should've probably better elaborated on the whole Chandy weather war bit For the most part, weather wars are a secondary function of Chandelure, with the primary being eliminating Pokemon that prevent Ludi+Kingdra from spamming Rain-boosted STAB moves, such as Celebi, Latias, and Chansey/Blissey. However, as an example, if the opponent gets Ninetales in Politoed, what's the harm in sending Chandy in? Either he/she doubles into a Chlorophyller and depending on what it is I can either trap and KO it outright or double back to a proper check, or just sponge a Will-O-Wisp / STAB move and proceed to either cripple it with Trick or spam Shadow Ball until it Roar's me out. Either way, I lose very little and gain a good deal, either in immediate damage or knowledge to the opponent's team structure / playstyle. Also it traps most Aboma almost immediately, which is neat lol. Edited December 7, 2012 by 49th Parallel Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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