Pocky Posted February 28, 2014 Share Posted February 28, 2014 "800 gold""25 movement speed"NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOI CAN'T GO FAST ANYMORE?OR AT LEASTI CAN'T GO AS FAST;; Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neo Posted February 28, 2014 Share Posted February 28, 2014 That's the base. The bonus is still fast as fuck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shanco Posted February 28, 2014 Share Posted February 28, 2014 By fan demand, the Special Forces Varus has been realized! Original thread: http://forums.na.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=3563463 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Godot Posted February 28, 2014 Share Posted February 28, 2014 Dat shoopdawhoop sweeps late game Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neo Posted February 28, 2014 Share Posted February 28, 2014 http://images.wikia.com/leagueoflegends/images/d/d3/Heimerdinger.attack11.ogg RAISE YOUR - WHAT?!!? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neo Posted March 2, 2014 Share Posted March 2, 2014 Double post because fuck you, I can. This site put most of the major LoL sites into one. It's fantastic, so you should defs check it out. http://2ez.gg/ Triple edited in post: VOID FIZZ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fush Posted March 2, 2014 Author Share Posted March 2, 2014 Double post because fuck you, I can. This site put most of the major LoL sites into one. It's fantastic, so you should defs check it out. http://2ez.gg/ Triple edited in post: VOID FIZZ! oh mY FUCKING GOD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shanco Posted March 8, 2014 Share Posted March 8, 2014 http://community.pbe.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/champions-gameplay-feedback/jHhmhlGe-lets-talk-about-lee-sin-retune Lee Sin rework's here. All tentative right now, but they'd be gutting him at this rate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WanderoftheColossus Posted March 8, 2014 Share Posted March 8, 2014 http://community.pbe.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/champions-gameplay-feedback/jHhmhlGe-lets-talk-about-lee-sin-retune Lee Sin rework's here. All tentative right now, but they'd be gutting him at this rate. Not a huge fan of lee sin, these changes so far aren't completely destroying him it just means that he scales appropriately. Lee sin is a great champ but what he offered (the ability to do everything) was too great. He could fill every role on a team (except adc but even then you'd be surprised) and not just fill but he would excel at it. Support lee sin, free harass and escape. Top lee sin, mobility for days. Jungle Lee sin, op ganks. Mid Lee sin, frail champs fall at his feet. I'm liking these changes so far. It makes you choose what role you want to play because you'll have to build damage to actually deal damage, unlike now where you can build full tank with a last whisper or ravenous and just destroy everything. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sylvan Nephilim Posted March 8, 2014 Share Posted March 8, 2014 A Lee Sin with Last Whisper and Ravenous Hydra is, by definition, not full tank. Full tank is 6 defensive items, that's 2 offensive items already. After what Riot did to Skarner I don't have any faith in their ability to rework a champion. Instead of just adding the snare to his ult and leaving him be they absolutely gutted his identity by removing his close range slow and making him an Olaf wannabe duelist with no sticking power. Here, they're doing the same to Lee Sin. By changing his scaling to total AD from bonus AD, they're taking away the incentive to build full AD. That means Lee Sins will just build tank and use their ult as generic cc. After all, a pure AD caster can't exactly sit in the middle of a fight and take advantage of that 100% bonus attack speed that they shifted all his power to. If they wanted to make him be stronger late game and weaker early, they could have made his energy costs at level 1 be higher than live values and scale downwards as he gains levels so that he can't do all that crazy ninja stuff until later. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WanderoftheColossus Posted March 8, 2014 Share Posted March 8, 2014 A Lee Sin with Last Whisper and Ravenous Hydra is, by definition, not full tank. Full tank is 6 defensive items, that's 2 offensive items already. After what Riot did to Skarner I don't have any faith in their ability to rework a champion. Instead of just adding the snare to his ult and leaving him be they absolutely gutted his identity by removing his close range slow and making him an Olaf wannabe duelist with no sticking power. Here, they're doing the same to Lee Sin. By changing his scaling to total AD from bonus AD, they're taking away the incentive to build full AD. That means Lee Sins will just build tank and use their ult as generic cc. After all, a pure AD caster can't exactly sit in the middle of a fight and take advantage of that 100% bonus attack speed that they shifted all his power to. If they wanted to make him be stronger late game and weaker early, they could have made his energy costs at level 1 be higher than live values and scale downwards as he gains levels so that he can't do all that crazy ninja stuff until later. read carefully, i said or not and. By the way. Tank lee sin is much better by far than damage lee sin. Damage lee sin falls off mad hard anyways. He was meant to be a tank when he was released and that's what they trying to get people to do now. Fulfill the role he was meant to be. Just like people were pissed off about ap yi no longer being a thing, its for the improvement of the game. Keep in mind, these changes are tenative, nothing is set in stone yet. They have to do a lot of in house testing first to see how it works, what needs to be changed. Don't take the first draft as the final draft. I like the direction theyre going in so far. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shanco Posted March 8, 2014 Share Posted March 8, 2014 You kiddin? The removal of AP Yi was a miracle to the community, the only people that really hated his removal were the bronze players who could only really win with Yi and Not anyone else. Also yes, the Lee changes are very much tentative. However, the changes are being received extremely negatively by the community (almost on the level of that Jayce rework that got scrapped). But if this is what happens to Lee, I'm cool with it. I'm tired of him being picked/banned every game, to be honest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WanderoftheColossus Posted March 8, 2014 Share Posted March 8, 2014 (edited) You kiddin? The removal of AP Yi was a miracle to the community, the only people that really hated his removal were the bronze players who could only really win with Yi and Not anyone else. Also yes, the Lee changes are very much tentative. However, the changes are being received extremely negatively by the community (almost on the level of that Jayce rework that got scrapped). But if this is what happens to Lee, I'm cool with it. I'm tired of him being picked/banned every game, to be honest. picked/banned every game? That's not the case at all...not where i'm at anyways. A lot of people were angry about the removal of ap yi and the removal of ap trynd and if you were playing back in S1 back when you could literally perma stun with taric because your cooldowns were so low and damage was mad high. Edited March 8, 2014 by WanderoftheColossus Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sylvan Nephilim Posted March 8, 2014 Share Posted March 8, 2014 read carefully, i said or not and. By the way. Tank lee sin is much better by far than damage lee sin. Damage lee sin falls off mad hard anyways. He was meant to be a tank when he was released and that's what they trying to get people to do now. Fulfill the role he was meant to be. Just like people were pissed off about ap yi no longer being a thing, its for the improvement of the game. Keep in mind, these changes are tenative, nothing is set in stone yet. They have to do a lot of in house testing first to see how it works, what needs to be changed. Don't take the first draft as the final draft. I like the direction theyre going in so far. Removing alternate play styles because they fall off is a terrible choice. It takes choice away from the hands of the player and will make the best way to play the game be "on auto-pilot". Punishing people for building damage, which is fun and risky seems to go against everything they want to have in their game. Building tank is safe and boring. They could do these exact same changes to Pantheon. Pantheon's in the same position as Lee Sin, strong early game, can end the game if he gets ahead. Change all his scalings to 0.5 total AD from 2.0 bonus AD, quarter the base damages, change all his skills to physical damage... That would make tank Pantheon the only way to play Pantheon too, and stop Pantheon from ever being an early game monster, but it's not how people want to play these characters. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark Desire Posted March 8, 2014 Share Posted March 8, 2014 Ye I feel like the nerfs are really well placed, although I think this might be the end of top sin But #neverseesagoodleesin so I probably won't even notice once the changes are finalized in put in Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WanderoftheColossus Posted March 9, 2014 Share Posted March 9, 2014 Removing alternate play styles because they fall off is a terrible choice. It takes choice away from the hands of the player and will make the best way to play the game be "on auto-pilot". Punishing people for building damage, which is fun and risky seems to go against everything they want to have in their game. Building tank is safe and boring. They could do these exact same changes to Pantheon. Pantheon's in the same position as Lee Sin, strong early game, can end the game if he gets ahead. Change all his scalings to 0.5 total AD from 2.0 bonus AD, quarter the base damages, change all his skills to physical damage... That would make tank Pantheon the only way to play Pantheon too, and stop Pantheon from ever being an early game monster, but it's not how people want to play these characters. See, this is what I'm talking about. You're mad because they're removing Lee Sin how he is now. That's the thing. He was never intended to be played, as Riot says: A tanky, ad, ap, jungler, top, mid, support character. His original base goal was for him to be a tank. So they're going back to making him be a tank. Of course you can still build damage and he'll actually deal a ton of damage, do the math/look at the scaling ratios again. But his main goal is to be stronger as a tank because thats what he was originally intended for when he was released Fun fact: Lee sin was actually a cancelled champion that had been tentatively announced but the community wanted him so badly that Riot did end up releasing him and they weren't exactly satisfied with how he could literally play EVERYTHING. Changes are going to happen, there is no need to be upset. These changes won't destroy his gameplay it just means that you have to be more skill at playing him/managing his energy. You're comparing him to pantheon and that isn't exactly a fair comparison. Pantheon is totally different. First off Pantheon was designed to have an early game advantage. Secondly they designed him to be an ARTISAN OF WAR so naturally he should be a MELEE FIGHTER. Thirdly, pantheon's kit doesn't have a spammable gap closer, Pantheon does not have a slow but what he does have is his nearly global ultimate. Lee sin currently can kite, gap close, slow, knock back or forward and deal way too much damage. What they want to do with him is fair and justified. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wes Posted March 9, 2014 Share Posted March 9, 2014 (Fun fact: Lee sin was actually a cancelled champion that had been tentatively announced but the community wanted him so badly that Riot did end up releasing him and they weren't exactly satisfied with how he could literally play EVERYTHING.) If he's a champ that the community wanted, they'd listen to the community more on how his playstyle should be. Also, he's not more skill-based now, he's nerfed. He was already the most skill based champ in the League. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Developers Voctrode Posted March 9, 2014 Developers Share Posted March 9, 2014 ikaru is playing jinx gg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pocky Posted March 9, 2014 Share Posted March 9, 2014 So like, totally off topic, but I'm starting to be matched with golds and rarely platinums.IT'S HAPPENINGlike srs i need to get gud Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shanco Posted March 9, 2014 Share Posted March 9, 2014 Just came back from a trip to the peebs with some thoughts on post-buff Annie. Game Summary (sort of) Started the game with Doran's Ring + 2 as well as a point in Incinerate (W). Incinerate base nerfs were very much felt here but was still able to outtrade LeBlanc at level 1. Level 3 was when things got interesting. I ate a Q + E from LeBlanc, farmed a little more by spamming my Q and backed, but Kassadin arrived and together they tower dived me and I was defenseless; Kassadin Flash + W'd for the kill but got executed. My damage output was low throughout most of the laning phase, and I couldn't even stay in lane since I was 100-0'd three times under tower by LeBlanc, the second and third times through my E as Udyr simply watched and did nothing. She hit 9 by the time I reached 5 and I didn't get a jungle gank since Udyr wasn't interested in leaving his jungle. Thankfully at 6 we caught Kassadin trying to steal our blue and we killed him by dropping a bear on his ass when I hit 7. The first items I built were Abyssal Scepter and Boots of Mobility, my normal buys on Annie; however compared to the pre-buff Annie, the damage scaling was far greater. Funny how 10% AP can make all the difference, I was doing a lot more damage than I had expected; in many cases where I had to use my full kit to burst the enemy down before the buffs, a Tibbers + Q did the trick now. Also, LeBlanc didn't kill me again following Abyssal Scepter's purchase. I won the lane with the tower and a 60 CS advantage (but was short 3 kills, so I was still ahead) The first teamfight, after I had bought Rabadon's Deathcap, was when the Annie changes really came into their own. I initiated onto Nautilus with a Flash + Tibbers and finished him off with a Q. Since the Q's cooldown was about 2 seconds after last hitting Nautilus with it, I was also able to kill Lucian with a second Q almost immediately. The third Q stunned Kassadin keeping him pinned down long enough for Twitch to kill him off and clean up the fight for the triple kill and the Ace. The changes to the Q were actually quite beneficial as well; after the Abyssal + Rabadon's I could one-shot the normal minions with a spell on a 2 second cooldown, not to mention the E bounces damage back to your attackers. I splitpushed almost as quickly as a melee ADC minus the towers because, you know, I was Annie. I did get ganked by the entire enemy team but was able to take top inner turret + two kills onto Kassadin and Lucian before Irelia finished me off. Thoughts: My kind of mage. Annie seems to be more of a ticking time bomb with these changes to her bases and ratios, and while her early damage is still there (though not as prominent), she can farm up well for her late game which is godly with the AoE damage. Her Q and W hit like a truck late compared to pre-buff Annie. Mid game is still the same as it was albeit with greater pushing power due to the "reset" on her Q. I like where these changes are going. My thoughts are a wee bit scattered just 'cuz, will clarify for anyone who wants me to later, and I will continue testing against different opponents. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WanderoftheColossus Posted March 9, 2014 Share Posted March 9, 2014 (edited) (Fun fact: Lee sin was actually a cancelled champion that had been tentatively announced but the community wanted him so badly that Riot did end up releasing him and they weren't exactly satisfied with how he could literally play EVERYTHING.) If he's a champ that the community wanted, they'd listen to the community more on how his playstyle should be. Also, he's not more skill-based now, he's nerfed. He was already the most skill based champ in the League. Not if the playstyle was too overpowered which -hint hint- lee sin is. Lee sin is one of the most over power champions in the game. Not in terms of damage but in terms of diversity just like in the same way Irelia's kit is so broken its overpowered. Edited March 9, 2014 by WanderoftheColossus Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shanco Posted March 9, 2014 Share Posted March 9, 2014 He was already the most skill based champ in the League. Lee has too much targeted damage and utility to be the most skill-based; you need to only land one skillshot to unload your entire kit on someone then press W click on an ally to bail. I'd hand that award to Thresh taking all factors into account, and this video to show you the nuts shit he's capable of: NOTE: Bunny Fufuu has since been named the new support for Team Curse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sylvan Nephilim Posted March 9, 2014 Share Posted March 9, 2014 Personally I don't think either Lee Sin nor Irelia have an overpowered kit and their numbers aren't overpowered either. They have kits focused around close quarters fighting with limited CC and sustain. Now a champion like Nidalee, for example, is overpowered both in the kit aspect and the numbers department. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wes Posted March 9, 2014 Share Posted March 9, 2014 The thing about Lee Sin is, if you want to succeed with him, you need to be mechanically inclined and you need to perform nearly or completely perfect to actually succeed. You have to land your Q, you have to hit the right target, and you have to set up a pick yourself. If you miss your Q, you just stand there and are fodder for the enemy. Sometimes you can get out by kicking them away, but most of the time not if the enemy team is competant at following up on your mistakes. As for him being the most skill based, I may be wrong, but what would be your examples of champions that require more skill overall than the king of mechanics? As for him being overpowered, versatility in playstyles isn't overpowered. If you want every champion to be played the same way all the time, you're literally wanting the metagame to become stale and boring. Overpowered would be pick or ban all the time and that he has no room for counterplay unless he's a terrible Lee. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Ikaru Posted March 9, 2014 Administrators Share Posted March 9, 2014 ikaru is playing jinx gg and we lost so clearly she's stupid and I shouldn't have done it- it's science just look at your signature *sagenod* Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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