Did Ultra Instict Ruin DBS?

[LOLZLION]

So, I've been thinking.  Why couldn't Jiren,Toppo or Vegeta go ultra instinct? I don't get it. They all got beaten up at some point. They're powerful enough ( At least Jiren is) .  So why didn't Vegeta go ultra instinct when Jiren was beating him up? Or Toppo when Vegeta was beating him up? Or Jiren when Goku was beating him up. It seems like lazy plot armor. They don't even have the excuse that it's just a saiyan thing this time. It seems like nothing but a lazy excuse to make Goku more powerful. What do you guys think?

[AyTales]

46 minutes ago, LOLZLION said:

So, I've been thinking.  Why couldn't Jiren,Toppo or Vegeta go ultra instinct? I don't get it. They all got beaten up at some point. They're powerful enough ( At least Jiren is) .  So why didn't Vegeta go ultra instinct when Jiren was beating him up? Or Toppo when Veget was beating him up? Or Jiren when Goku was beating him up. It seems like lazy plot armor. They don't even have the excuse that it's just a saiyan thing this time. It seems like nothing but a lazy excuse to make Goku more powerful. What do you guys think?

 

Ultra Instinct isn't something that's strength based or need based. It's a state of mind that comes from letting your instincts take over everything you do. It allows you to act using only the energy needed to accomplish your goal. Dodging by millimeters, hitting only as hard as needed, etc.

 

The other characters didn't do this because they weren't able to enter that state of mind due to one mental block or another. They all COULD given time, but it's an exceptionally difficult thing to do.

Edited November 14, 2018 by Aegisth

[JoStarNight]

The answer to your secondary question is simple; Goku is the main character and only he is allowed to dye his hair the latest color, thanks to his premium membership called Plot Armour. So yes, you are correct in saying that Ultra Instinct is a lazy excuse to make Goku more powerful.

 

As for Ultra Instinct ruining DBS, broken power scaling took care of that long before Ultra Instinct showed up.

Edited November 14, 2018 by JoStarNight

[LOLZLION]

Just now, Aegisth said:

 

Ultra Instinct isn't something that's strength based or need based. It's a state of mind that comes from letting your instincts take over everything you do. It allows you to act using only the energy needed to accomplish your goal. Dodging by millimeters, hitting only as hard as needed, etc.

 

The other character didn't do this because they weren't able to enter that state of mind due to one mental block or another. They all COULD given time, but it's an exceptionally difficult thing to do.

That seems like a pretty lame excuse. Goku is the ONLY one of the 4 who can clear his mind? I don't buy it. You'd think that in his roughly 770 years of training Jiren would have learned to clear his mind. I mean you could say a saibaman could get UI because he could clear his mind, but not Jiren,Toppo or Vegeta.  And if that's all it takes, why hasn't anyone gone UI before? If all they need to do is clear their mind I don't see why Kid Buu couldn't go UI. Just saying.

[AyTales]

1 minute ago, LOLZLION said:

That seems like a pretty lame excuse. Goku is the ONLY one of the 4 who can clear his mind? I don't buy it. You'd think that in his roughly 770 years of training Jiren would have learned to clear his mind. I mean you could say a saibaman could get UI because he could clear his mind, but not Jiren,Toppo or Vegeta.  And if that's all it takes, why hasn't anyone gone UI before? If all they need to do is clear their mind I don't see why Kid Buu couldn't go UI. Just saying.

People have gone UI before, but the Gods have said that it's extraordinarily rare and usually only GoDs or Angels managed to reach that level. Most of the Gods of Destruction couldn't manage it, either.

 

Goku's just a prodigy among prodigies. Main character complex mainly, but the others simply didn't fall into the right state of mind. Note I don't say "clear their mind". It's a state of mind.

[LOLZLION]

1 minute ago, Aegisth said:

People have gone UI before, but the Gods have said that it's extraordinarily rare and usually only GoDs or Angels managed to reach that level. Most of the Gods of Destruction couldn't manage it, either.

 

Goku's just a prodigy among prodigies. Main character complex mainly, but the others simply didn't fall into the right state of mind. Note I don't say "clear their mind". It's a state of mind.

Actually, Goku's a low class warrior. Vegeta has at least 10x the talent goku does. Goku just got strong after training in King Kai's planet. That's why when Vegeta got ssj, he was able to beat android 19 when Goku couldn't, and was able to beat golden Frieza in ssb when Goku couldn't.  And Jiren and Toppo certainly have talent.  So what exactly makes Goku able to achieve this state of mind, but not Jiren, Toppo or Vegeta, who have much more raw talent?

[AyTales]

5 minutes ago, LOLZLION said:

Actually, Goku's a low class warrior. Vegeta has at least 10x the talent goku does. Goku just got strong after training in King Kai's planet. That's why when Vegeta got ssj, he was able to beat android 19 when Goku couldn't, and was able to beat golden Frieza in ssb when Goku couldn't.  And Jiren and Toppo certainly have talent.  So what exactly makes Goku able to achieve this state of mind, but not Jiren, Toppo or Vegeta, who have much more raw talent?

wow. No, this is entirely wrong.

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Goku's a low class warrior

 

Vegeta is who claimed this, and it was bigotry more than anything. "High class warriors" were determined entirely by PL. Those with 10k+ power level were considered elite.

 

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Vegeta has at least 10x the talent goku does.

And yet Goku has achieved every significant transformation well before Vegeta did. Note how during the 7 year gap, Goku managed SSJ3 while Vegeta only did SSJ2. Note that in the few weeks travelling to Namek, Goku majorly eclipsed Vegeta. Not going to bother going through every other instance. They're numerous.

 

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That's why when Vegeta got ssj, he was able to beat android 19 when Goku couldn't

Goku couldn't beat Android 19 because the heart virus hit...

 

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was able to beat golden Frieza in ssb when Goku couldn't

Vegeta beat Freeza because Goku wore him out.

 

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So what exactly makes Goku able to achieve this state of mind, but not Jiren, Toppo or Vegeta, who have much more raw talent?

Like I said, Main Character syndrome. It's the same reason on why Goku managed to beat Vegeta in the Saiyan Saga, why he went SSJ first, why he was able to go SSJ3. He's the main character, so he gets the upgrades first, in general.

Edited November 14, 2018 by Aegisth

[LOLZLION]

6 minutes ago, Aegisth said:

wow. No, this is entirely wrong.

 

Vegeta is who claimed this, and it was bigotry more than anything. "High class warriors" were determined entirely by PL. Those with 10k+ power level were considered elite.

 

And yet Goku has achieved every significant transformation well before Vegeta did. Note how during the 7 year gap, Goku managed SSJ3 while Vegeta only did SSJ2. Note that in the few weeks travelling to Namek, Goku majorly eclipsed Vegeta. Not going to bother going through every other instance. They're numerous.

 

Goku couldn't beat Android 19 because the heart virus hit...

 

Vegeta beat Freeza because Goku wore him out.

 

Like I said, Main Character syndrome. It's the same reason on why Goku managed to beat Vegeta in the Saiyan Saga, why he went SSJ first, why he was able to go SSJ3. He's the main character, so he gets the upgrades first, in general.

Oh.  LOL sorry. Thx for correcting me.

[Corso]

On 11/14/2018 at 8:41 PM, JoStarNight said:

Goku is the main character and only he is allowed to dye his hair the latest color

Goku wasn't the first to reach SSJ2 and complete SSJB (at least in the anime).

 

On 11/14/2018 at 9:07 PM, Aegisth said:

Goku managed to beat Vegeta in the Saiyan Saga

Goku had already been defeated before Yajirobe cut his tail and Krillin hit him with the Spirit Bomb.

 

On 11/14/2018 at 8:51 PM, LOLZLION said:

You'd think that in his roughly 770 years of training Jiren would have learned to clear his mind

Where does this come from?

 

As for Ultra Instinct, it's a matter of talent and character. It's only natural that there's someone better than the others in a particular thing, sometimes protagonists are given this trait. If you really consider it "main character complex" or "plot armour" maybe you should try watching other genres.