Dev Blog | V12 Status Thread

[Alisae]

I already hate dynamaxing just by the what it is, how I feel like it would change battling, and its name.

I think the name is the worst part about the mechanic.

[Fallen Savior Morgan]

3 hours ago, Commander said:

For the love of, I'm not mad at you, but it does grind my gears a bit how people beg for stuff ESPECIALLY when it hasn't even come into existence yet. Dynamax could be an awful mechanic everyone despises and then that'd be a waste of all that time planning something nobody wants. Jan already said Gen 8 was on the table to include which is way beyond what you could ask for someone who spends 3-4 times as much time making this game as you think. Just take this life lesson: be grateful for the things you do get even if you are hopeful for more.

 

No seriously, you don't get full on fan passion projects of this scale other than a sheer few lucky franchises and pretty much all other fandoms would kill to have this many massive projects at this point in production at this quality. You think a Jan or Ame kind of dev is going to just appear out of nowhere and just magically make a free fan game similar to your interest? I'm sorry, but that's wishful thinking. It might, but it might be a few years before something surfaces. I'm sorry to scare you, but you really should think what you ask of people especially if you aren't willing to put forth the effort yourself. If Jan doesn't want to do Dynamax, he shouldn't have to. It's time and work taken away from improving scripts, improving the quality, etc. This stuff doesn't magically come together and work within a week or two.

 

As for the whole Gen 8 stuff, Jan, I'll give you my simple thoughts: don't ever do something needless that'll start burning you out. There's 800 mons. People can live without 100 of them. But if you and the team are excited and really want to put forth the massive resources for such a project and feat, I say go for it. There's pros and cons for doing and not doing it. You have well over a year to decide on it so it's not something to rush a decision that you'll regret later. Just ignore the people going "Man, I really want Rejuv to implement Gen 8" or "So when's Gen 8 coming?" If you're really a fan of Rejuv, either decision shouldn't be the cause of you dropping the game as that'd be ridiculous refusing to play something just because "Wooloo" isn't in it.

 

And now with that rant over time for something more enjoyable

 

OMG GUYZ! ALBA IS ALMOIST DON! CAN I BE EN TAH BETAH AZ I AM A MAD SKILLZ GAMAH! THO THIZ GAME EZ TOO HEARD AND NEEDZ NERD HERD! I STALL BET IT THO! AND I HELPZ HERD! WHAR DO I SING UP?

i understand but it was a suggestion. I never wanted it in the game, it is up to Jan on what he does in the game. also i am not planning on buying swsh because my parents wont so i am not complaining about anything anyone is doing or planning now am I, and for the love of ARCEUS IT WAS A FREAKING SUGGESTION OR DO I NEED TO TYPE THAT ONE HUNDRED OR FEW HUNDRED TIMES SO THAT YOU CAN GET THROUGH YOUR NARROW MIND. HERE IT IS, SUGGESTION X 1 MILLION. SUGGESTIONS PEOPLE. IT WAS NOTHING MORE THAN A SUGGESTION. )=(

 

BY THE WAY THAT WAS A FROWN. NOW THEN IF WE ARE DONE WITH THIS POINTLESS DISCUSSION LET US NEVER REPEAT THIS AGAIN. I DIDNT JOIN THE REBORN A WEEK AGO JUST TO LISTEN TO THIS RANT THROWN AT ONE PERSON BECAUSE IT WAS A FREAKING SUGGESTION. OH MY GOD SUGGESTIONS SUGGESTIONS, DID YOU NOT READ THE PREVIOUS COMMENT. IT WAS A SUGGESTION. MEANING JAN COULD DO IT ANYTIME HE WANTS TO. OR DO I NEED TO SPELL IT MORE PEOPLE. S U G G E S T I O N. AM I NOW CLEAR MR.COMMANDER ALSO WHEN DID I BEG FOR DYNAMAXING TO BE A THING WHEN, DID YOU READ THAT I HAVE BEGGED OR PLEADED FOR IT TO BE A THING. DID I OR DID I NOT. ALSO FOR A FACT I HAVE NEVER STATED FOR ME TO BE IN THE GAME WHEN YOU QUOTE SOMEONE, IT TENDS TO BE SOMETIMES HARMING TO PEOPLE, ALSO I DONT PLAY GAMES SO THAT I CAN BE IN ONE, WHY DO YOU THINK ROLEPLAYING EXISTS GOOD SIR. POKEMON IS A ROLE PLAYING GAME IF I HAVE TO MAKE THAT FACT MORE OBVIOUS THAN IT IS. ALSO WHAT GIVES YOU THE RIGHT TO SPEAK FOR OTHERS YOU DONT KNOW THEM AND MORE THAN THE YOU ARE NOT THEM SO YOU CANT JUST SAY THAT AND BLAME IT ON ONE PERSON BECAUSE I MADE A STUPID LITTLE SUGGESTION OH MY GOD MORE TIMES IT WAS A SUGGESTION. S U G G E S T I O N 

 

IT INFURIATES ME THAT PEOPLE CAN JUST BLAME OTHER PEOPLE SO EASILY FOR SOEMTHING AS STUPID AS SUGGESTIONS HAVE YOU NEVER MADE ANY SUGGESTIONS IN YOUR LIFE CAN YOU EXPLAIN THAT. MORE MOW SUGGESTIONS PEOPLE

I DID NOT SAY THAT IT HAD TO BE DONE NOW SINCE THE VERSION IS FINISHED. IT WAS A SUGGESTION FOR THE FUTURE IF JAN PLANNED FOR IT

Edited June 24, 2019 by Harsh Bhakta

[una]

please no dynamax unless nintendo brings something plot-twist worthy to the table with dynamax its the laziest mechanic i've seen imo

[Myrrh]

The main issue with said suggestion is that Jan already went out and said what he plans to include and what he plans not to include with regard to Gen 8.  All the posts about it afterward is in way disruptive and comes off as ungrateful for what Jan already said he'd do.  As Commander said, it takes a lot of time and effort to do something like this and Jan has already said he'd do even more by saying what he is planning to include.  Rejuvenation does not need either Dynamaxing or Raid Battles either.  The later of which is already essentially fulfilled, and done better, with Rift Pokemon.  You even have Ren, Venam, or Erin help out in defeating specific Rift Pokemon as it is.  The former, as Commander said, could very well be executed so badly that it'd be more trouble than it's worth to have added.

 

Spoiler

Personally, I'm more than happy to see Jan is not planning to waste his time trying to implement either.  Dynamax in particular looks both lazy and uninteresting and I much prefer what Mega Evolution and Z-Moves add to the gameplay, the former in particular.

 

Edited June 24, 2019 by Myrrh

[Fallen Savior Morgan]

I know that games just don't come in existence with magic as unrealistic as that sounds but sheesh he didn't have to lash out at me because of my idiotic comment. Please I am done yelling my voice is almost gone so please put it to rest. Also S U G G E S T I O N S people, meaning anytime, not currently since it is finished

Edited June 24, 2019 by Harsh Bhakta

[Commander]

Dude, you don't have to read the rants and don't take them personal. Sometimes people make posts again and again suggesting it so may as well have something to refer back to when it keeps coming up. If one person asks, 30 or more are probably reading and wondering the same thing. And if I do tick you off, it's better to handle it in PMs (always open).

 

And honestly, I'm really surprised by the displeasure people seem to have with Dynamax. I thought it looked ok and something that could be okay replacing the old Mega and Z-move system permanently but to each their own. 

[Fallen Savior Morgan]

2 minutes ago, Commander said:

Dude, you don't have to read the rants and don't take them personal. Sometimes people make posts again and again suggesting it so may as well have something to refer back to when it keeps coming up. If one person asks, 30 or more are probably reading and wondering the same thing. And if I do tick you off, it's better to handle it in PMs (always open).

 

And honestly, I'm really surprised by the displeasure people seem to have with Dynamax. I thought it looked ok and something that could be okay replacing the old Mega and Z-move system permanently but to each their own. 

It could be taken seriously due the context of the way it is and quoting someone places a target on the commenter and it seems as it is told that person specifically, now that I have calm down with tea, I am sorry for the way I have behaved and no longer do i wish to touch this subject ever again. Also next time I'll do that, I am sorry.

[Magus543]

Well least people settled this civilly, It's a common pitfall when it comes to projects like fangames, that adding in too many ideas just kinda dilutes the game, like does anyone remember this game has Shadow Pokemon? 

[Fallen Savior Morgan]

Just now, Magus543 said:

Well least people settled this civilly, It's a common pitfall when it comes to projects like fangames, that adding in too many ideas just kinda dilutes the game, like does anyone remember this game has Shadow Pokemon? 

yeah and i have some in my pc, it stopped being relevent after rens betrayal

[Magus543]

6 minutes ago, Harsh Bhakta said:

yeah and i have some in my pc, it stopped being relevent after rens betrayal

See, the reason why Shadow Pokemon in the Gamecube games worked, is because they are the main point of the game, like you see them not just from generic grunts but from trainers too, and because the games don't have many wild pokemon to capture so they were a good source of Pokemon. Rejuvenation HAS wild pokemon so the Shadow Pokemon are redundant. Additionally Shadow Pokemon was the main weapon of Cipher, their plan was to conquer the world with them. But in Rejuvenation, Team Xen just thinks of them as elite mooks and stop producing them eventually. Hell even the official art posted by Zumi recently of the PCs doesn't have any Snag Machines on them, that's how forgotten Shadow Pokemon are by the dev team. This is what i mean when you have a cool idea but don't implement it well, it just falls to the wayside. No insult to the dev team, i think the current direction is better.
 

Edited June 24, 2019 by Magus543

[Myrrh]

Shadow Pokemon are used by Team Xen members during Team Xen operations.  Thus, we haven't really had many times where they would have been able to show up from when we had last seen them.  The plot has been preoccupied by Team Bladestar as of recent, which draws attention away from Team Xen and their devices (our last interaction was cooperating with Madame X to get back from the altered future and working with Ren - if one even counts that as a Team Xen interaction.)  The last actual operation where we can catch Shadow Pokemon is actually in Amber's home when it is attacked by Madelis.  From that point, the only other time we really came into direct conflict with Team Xen was on Mount Valor.  One can also go back and catch a Shadow Beldum for a later instance of a Shadow Pokemon.  So it isn't so much that Shadow Pokemon are discontinued, it's more like that they are not in our peripherals due to where we are in the plot.

 

Other plot reasons why Shadow Pokemon don't show up as much as Colosseum or Shadow of Darkness are because:

 

~ Team Xen were early on established as having revived the project.

~ Team Xen were early on established to have had only managed to create a small supply of Shadow Pokemon.

~ Nastasia went to the backup lab to be able to continue the project and resupply their organization with Shadow Pokemon, hence why Mount Valor lacked any Shadow Pokemon one could catch.

 

Shadow Pokemon are very likely to show up more when Team Xen launches more operations for us to deal with.

Edited June 24, 2019 by Myrrh

[Fallen Savior Morgan]

That makes clear sense now, basically it was there when the plot requires it and it was just forgotten over time.

[Magus543]

15 minutes ago, Myrrh said:

Shadow Pokemon are used by Team Xen members during Team Xen operations.  Thus, we haven't really had many times where they would have been able to show up from when we had last seen them.  The plot has been preoccupied by Team Bladestar as of recent, which draws attention away from Team Xen and their devices (our last interaction was cooperating with Madame X to get back from the altered future and working with Ren - if one even counts that as a Team Xen interaction.)  The last actual operation where we can catch Shadow Pokemon is actually in Amber's home when it is attacked by Madelis.  From that point, the only other time we really came into direct conflict with Team Xen was on Mount Valor.  One can also go back and catch a Shadow Beldum for a later instance of a Shadow Pokemon.  So it isn't so much that Shadow Pokemon are discontinued, it's more like that they are not in our peripherals due to where we are in the plot.

 

Other plot reasons why Shadow Pokemon don't show up as much as Colosseum or Shadow of Darkness are because:

 

~ Team Xen were early on established as having revived the project.

~ Team Xen were early on established to have had only managed to create a small supply of Shadow Pokemon.

~ Nastasia went to the backup lab to be able to continue the project and resupply their organization with Shadow Pokemon, hence why Mount Valor lacked any Shadow Pokemon one could catch.

 

Shadow Pokemon are very likely to show up more when Team Xen launches more operations for us to deal with.

Good point, it is true we haven't fought Team Xen in a LONG time, though if the dev team really wanted Shadow Pokemon, i could really see Team Bladestar using them especially since Flora did have access to Team Xen's research, though so far we only know FLora knows about Rift Matter. Plus Team Bladestar is willing to kill so i can see how Shadow Pokemon would help in overthrowing Cassandra. Regardless, Shadow Pokemon in Rejuvenation don't have the same presence they have in the Gamecube games. But who knows, maybe if they do come back, they'll be improved on.

[ZappoNinja]

1 minute ago, Magus543 said:

Good point, it is true we haven't fought Team Xen in a LONG time, though if the dev team really wanted Shadow Pokemon, i could really see Team Bladestar using them especially since Flora did have access to Team Xen's research, though so far we only know FLora knows about Rift Matter. Plus Team Bladestar is willing to kill so i can see how Shadow Pokemon would help in overthrowing Cassandra. Regardless, Shadow Pokemon in Rejuvenation don't have the same presence they have in the Gamecube games. But who knows, maybe if they do come back, they'll be improved on.

Creating Shadow Pokemon seems to be expensive, especially to keep them Shadow, so I feel like Flora would rather use those expenses on something moreso cheap like Rift Pokemon as extensive research is needed to cure a rift Pokemon but just walking around is all that is needed to cure Shadow Pokemon and once free they'd probably resist being told what to do until Shadowified again. So it makes more sense for Team Xen to use them and not Bladestar.

[Myrrh]

1) You forget that Flora went out of her way to ensure that the Rift transformation would not hurt the Pokemon that is being changed.  She researched Pulse transformations with Dr. Jenkel to ensure that the Pokemon would be put into an enjoyable state of being.  Shadow Pokemon, in contrast, entirely lose themselves and become crazed to the point they begin to damage themselves due to becoming overwhelmed by their own state of being.

 

2) This assumes Flora was able to find information on Shadow Pokemon from where she was.  For all we know, the information related to Shadow Pokemon could very well have all been in the lab under Madelis' control in Sheridan and the Backup Lab.  Hence why Nastasia had to go directly there to retrieve all the necessary data and information.

[Magus543]

1 minute ago, ZappoNinja said:

Creating Shadow Pokemon seems to be expensive, especially to keep them Shadow, so I feel like Flora would rather use those expenses on something moreso cheap like Rift Pokemon as extensive research is needed to cure a rift Pokemon but just walking around is all that is needed to cure Shadow Pokemon and once free they'd probably resist being told what to do until Shadowified again. So it makes more sense for Team Xen to use them and not Bladestar.

Team Bladestar has an underground society, flying machines, machines that can vaporize forestry, at least 2 complex lairs, and Flora herself must get a lot of cash being a Gym Leader. I'm sure Bladestar doesn't have any money problems, just intelligence problems.

[ZappoNinja]

7 minutes ago, Magus543 said:

Team Bladestar has an underground society, flying machines, machines that can vaporize forestry, at least 2 complex lairs, and Flora herself must get a lot of cash being a Gym Leader. I'm sure Bladestar doesn't have any money problems, just intelligence problems.

If you follow Flora, tell her you saw what she did in Darchlight Forest, and then keep her secret hidden later in the game she mentions how making a secret base under her gym is expensive in which is why she had her base in Darchlight Cave at first. From this I decided that spending money on unnecessary things such as Shadow Pokemon probably isn't the most wanted thing for Team Bladestar as Rift Matter is definitely pushing it in the expense department especially when you spend money on making it so the Pokemon doesn't suffer. 

Edit: Oh yeah that's a much better reason for why they don't use Shadow Pokemon, if Flora will go out of her way to make her Rift Pokemon feel no suffering and just get a power boost why would she force Pokemon to suffer by making them Shadow Pokemon?

Edited June 24, 2019 by ZappoNinja
I realized something.

[Magus543]

11 minutes ago, Myrrh said:

1) You forget that Flora went out of her way to ensure that the Rift transformation would not hurt the Pokemon that is being changed.  She researched Pulse transformations with Dr. Jenkel to ensure that the Pokemon would be put into an enjoyable state of being.  Shadow Pokemon, in contrast, entirely lose themselves and become crazed to the point they begin to damage themselves due to becoming overwhelmed by their own state of being.

 

2) This assumes Flora was able to find information on Shadow Pokemon from where she was.  For all we know, the information related to Shadow Pokemon could very well have all been in the lab under Madelis' control in Sheridan and the Backup Lab.  Hence why Nastasia had to go directly there to retrieve all the necessary data and information.

Good point, Flora does care about her Pokemon, but does she care about her grunts and their Pokemon? At the end of 11 she supposedly blows up the Grand Dream Ball with her grunts inside plus she in general is utterly annoyed with them and she has destroyed environments in Darchlight forest even if she is planning to restore it... eventually. So i can see her converting Grunt pokemon into Shadows. Additionally according to the weird diary in the past, Rift Pokemon do have a connection/similarity to Shadow Pokemon, if not being the next step altogether, so Flora must know some process of shadowfication if she could turn her Ferrothorn into a rift, that and Shadow Pokemon were created by Cipher so if Team Xen could obtain information on it so could Team Bladestar Lastly, Flora ain't the only power in Bladestar, she herself mentions she's an admin, and the V in the Underground society has shown to be highly pragmatic, and the Bladestars in the Underground society are willing to experiment on a robot that has sentience, so it's not all up to Flora. 

[ZappoNinja]

5 minutes ago, Magus543 said:

Good point, Flora does care about her Pokemon, but does she care about her grunts and their Pokemon? At the end of 11 she supposedly blows up the Grand Dream Ball with her grunts inside plus she in general is utterly annoyed with them and she has destroyed environments in Darchlight forest even if she is planning to restore it... eventually. So i can see her converting Grunt pokemon into Shadows. Additionally according to the weird diary in the past, Rift Pokemon do have a connection/similarity to Shadow Pokemon, if not being the next step altogether, so Flora must know some process of shadowfication if she could turn her Ferrothorn into a rift, that and Shadow Pokemon were created by Cipher so if Team Xen could obtain information on it so could Team Bladestar Lastly, Flora ain't the only power in Bladestar, she herself mentions she's an admin, and the V in the Underground society has shown to be highly pragmatic, and the Bladestars in the Underground society are willing to experiment on a robot that has sentience, so it's not all up to Flora. 

We don't know if the Bladestar grunts had a means of surviving the blast yet. Would certainly be a good explanation for why Erin won't die. (Let's be honest, after Erin's whole "I REFUSE TO DIE HERE!" thing she's going to live somehow.) And Zetta in Nightmare City told us that to make Rift Pokemon all one needs is Rift Matter and then they just need to put it onto the Pokemon. No complicated process like submerging said Pokemon into some weird vat filled with unknown substances. Also they weren't experimenting on Ana, they were just trying to extract her nanodrive. Which they then would probably experiment on but who knows.

[Myrrh]

Flora's an extremist whose redeeming quality is meant to be her love for Pokemon.  Her being annoyed at her grunts shouldn't mean she loses her love for Pokemon just because they are under those she lacks any real respect for.  The issue with this comes from the game telling us this, rather than ever really showing us this outside one real instance.

 

The weird diary does indeed tell us that Rift Pokemon hold many similarities to Shadow Pokemon, but as told by Zetta in the Help Center request with Anabel and Looker it doesn't take an understanding of Shadow Pokemon to be able to create or make use of Rift Matter.  Zetta could produce Rift Matter, hence why he was able to create Rift Pokemon.  All it takes to make Rift Pokemon is Rift Matter, which Flora has plenty of.  She even details herself using it in the book one can find on how she used it, "So... We went ahead and applied Rift Matter to Ferrothorn and it went through immediate physical and psychological changes."  This is a lot more simple than how both Team Xen or Team Cipher made Shadow Pokemon.

 

@ZappoNinja Looks like I stated some similar things that you did.  Hope you don't mind.

Edited June 24, 2019 by Myrrh

[Fallen Savior Morgan]

maybe after the explosion the grunts leave on their jetpacks like the time they captured Reina or Flora just doesnt care and is lowkey heartless besides pokemon

Edited June 24, 2019 by Harsh Bhakta

[Magus543]

2 minutes ago, Myrrh said:

Flora's an extremist who's redeeming quality is meant to be her love for Pokemon.  Her being annoyed at her grunts shouldn't mean she loses her love of Pokemon just because it's under those she lacks any real respect for.  The issue with this comes from the game telling us this, rather than ever really showing us this outside one real instance.

 

The weird diary does indeed tell us that Rift Pokemon hold many similarities to Rift Pokemon, but as told by Zetta in the Help Center request with Anabel and Looker, it doesn't take an understanding of Shadow Pokemon to be able to make use of Rift Matter.  Zetta could produce Rift Matter, hence why he was able to create Rift Pokemon.  All it takes to make Rift Pokemon is Rift Matter, which Flora has plenty of.  She even details herself using it in the book one can find on how she used it, "So... We went ahead and applied Rift Matter to Ferrothorn and it went through immediate physical and psychological changes."  This is a lot more simple than how both Team Xen or Team Cipher made Shadow Pokemon.

 

@ZappoNinja Looks like I stated some similar things that you did.  Hope you don't mind.

Personally, i always interpreted Flora as only caring for her Pokemon, i mean she did spread corruption in the Darchlight woods which destroys environments that Pokemon live in, that's bound to have negative effects on them. Additionally Flora has shown herself very vindictive, like in one playthrough i saw, she frames her brother as a admin of Bladestar and condemns him to death while she escapes, while her brother was trying to spare her life from the death penalty, that's ice cold, so i could honestly see her making some use of Shadows.

 

That's a good point from both Zappo and Myrrh about Rift matter, and i will give props to Flora for finding a way to make it not painful, but it does show Flora and the rest of Bladestar are not above altering their Pokemon, so it's not out of character for them to use Shadow Pokemon, like i said, Flora is not the ringleader of Bladestar, there are other leaders beside her, and if Team Xen could recreate Cipher's Shadow Pokemon, i don't see why Bladestar couldn't too.

 

Lastly, Zappo, extracting the nano drive from Ana was pretty painful on her end, so my point still stands.  

[ZappoNinja]

6 minutes ago, Magus543 said:

Personally, i always interpreted Flora as only caring for her Pokemon, i mean she did spread corruption in the Darchlight woods which destroys environments that Pokemon live in, that's bound to have negative effects on them. Additionally Flora has shown herself very vindictive, like in one playthrough i saw, she frames her brother as a admin of Bladestar and condemns him to death while she escapes, while her brother was trying to spare her life from the death penalty, that's ice cold, so i could honestly see her making some use of Shadows.

 

That's a good point from both Zappo and Myrrh about Rift matter, and i will give props to Flora for finding a way to make it not painful, but it does show Flora and the rest of Bladestar are not above altering their Pokemon, so it's not out of character for them to use Shadow Pokemon, like i said, Flora is not the ringleader of Bladestar, there are other leaders beside her, and if Team Xen could recreate Cipher's Shadow Pokemon, i don't see why Bladestar couldn't too.

 

Lastly, Zappo, extracting the nano drive from Ana was pretty painful on her end, so my point still stands.  

Either way we'll get our answers in the future. 
@MyrrhNah man, it's cool, I don't mind at all. 

[Magus543]

5 minutes ago, ZappoNinja said:

Either way we'll get our answers in the future. 
@MyrrhNah man, it's cool, I don't mind at all. 

I actually love discussing lore, thanks for chatting.

[ZappoNinja]

4 minutes ago, Magus543 said:

I actually love discussing lore, thanks for chatting.

I like chatting lore too as then I'm reminded of certain things I may have forgotten/missed. And no problem.