The one time I believe Reborn crosses to unfair territory

[Hamster Haze]

I’m sure some if not most know of one of the most ‘unfair’ battles in reborn right now Facing Shelly for the first time. That damn ditto/arceus. I’m more or less talking about the choice before it 

Spoiler

Whether you believe El or Randomus

 

Believing Randomus makes the El fight required to progress the story but believing El allows you to lose the battle to progress but has slight consequences with characters later on

Could this battle be considered ‘too unfair’ when the game is suppose to be a challenge? This is the only time I was forced to make a choice I didn’t like in the game because of that battle all so I could get by without beating it (there are other examples of this later in the game, but are on the difficult but fair spectrum). I know there are ways to beat the ditto/arceus, and that some battles are purposely hard to beat and do require very specific sets to win but I feel like this one battle was the most unfair partly because I was restricted story wise more than in other times.

[kithas]

Well, it could be said that if you want to stand your ground (meaning support Radomus in front of El) you have to be able to defend it, or else you might have to comply. 

I remember dittoceus being Reborn-level hellish (Like some PULSEs, like Swalot, or even Garchomp...), but I think "unfair" is an adjective best used for speaking about the gauntlet in the latest episode. 

[Sayaman]

I wouldnt call the gauntlet unfair. At that point of the game you have enough resources to build a really solid team to handle it. Was it frustrating? Definitely. It was one of the best challenges in the whole game? Most definitely.

[AyTales]

1 minute ago, Sayaman said:

I wouldnt call the gauntlet unfair. At that point of the game you have enough resources to build a really solid team to handle it. Was it frustrating? Definitely. It was one of the best challenges in the whole game? Most definitely.

He's not talking about the gauntlet.

[Sayaman]

I was "responding" to what kithas said.

[GenEric]

dittoceus was fine if you have a niche dusknoir with confide so his shadow balls dont hurt that much :pp

but honestly if you have good team comp which can resist judgement long enough then ur set

and the gauntlet should be easy if u have heat wave+rock slide combo

if not then use seeds, they exist for a reason

[kithas]

3 minutes ago, Sayaman said:

I wouldnt call the gauntlet unfair. At that point of the game you have enough resources to build a really solid team to handle it. Was it frustrating? Definitely. It was one of the best challenges in the whole game? Most definitely.

Unfair in the sense of the sheer number of Pokémon you have to defeat on a single battle

 

Dittoceus has the same flaw every legendary or overpowered battle has (and is designed with): It is alone, so you can devise good enough strategies to defeat it 

[Sayaman]

Yeah but a more fair challenge than a boss Pokemon one shotting everything. You even get healed after each fight as long you dont let your mons faint.

[Candy]

3 hours ago, L__Haze said:

this one battle was the most unfair partly because I was restricted story wise more than in other times.

Reborn ain't just a game you fight trainers, leaders and evil team and that's it. It has a yuge emphasis on story. it wouldn't make sense to side with Radomus and then lose to El. El won't be like "aww you tried, good effort", he's going to be like "ha! now gimme that Ruby Ring you loser". If you side with El though, it makes sense that he should be a bit more considerate even if you lose, cause at least you supported him.

 

1 hour ago, kithas said:

Unfair in the sense of the sheer number of Pokémon you have to defeat on a single battle

 

I think the same reasoning applies to the gauntlet too. You don't know what's happening while you've been hypnotized, but what really is happening is that three gym leaders have come rushing in to attempt to stop you. Of course they're going to use a lot of mons, in the hopes that if they battle you almost 3 vs 1, then you'll lose. It's a good plot point because it showcases the player's strength which is no longer match for the mid-tier gym leaders, but it requires much strategizing, which is also what Ame aims to make you do with the difficulty level of the game. Hope that even made sense, I'm half asleep lol

[Monochrome_Complex]

The gauntlet is very unfair, in how you're essentially fighting 3 bosses in a row, can't rearrange your team in between and have to start over each time. you fail, meaning your levels can get out of control quickly if you keep losing. And if you finish with a Z move you don't even get fully healed between fights due to a bug.

 

However in context of the story it makes sense and narratively does a good job in certifying how anna called you a "wrecking ball" earlier on. It's unfair but justifiably so.

 

I do hope the E4 doesn't pull the same thing though. 

 

FTR ditto arceus isn't that hard, especially if you have enough pokemon with bulldoze/earthquake lol. I think you can just collapse the field if all else fails, no? Get like 3 graveler with sturdy and spam bulldoze.

[wcv]

The Ditto fight is not unfair. From a gameplay perspective at least. From a story perspective, yes it certainly is. But this is POKEMON. One Pokemon, that isn't that much stronger than its opponents, is going to lose to a semi-prepared trainer with a full team and who knows what they are doing.

[Hamster Haze]

1 hour ago, wcv said:

The Ditto fight is not unfair. From a gameplay perspective at least. From a story perspective, yes it certainly is. But this is POKEMON. One Pokemon, that isn't that much stronger than its opponents, is going to lose to a semi-prepared trainer with a full team and who knows what they are doing.

Pulse mons fit the category too, and they sweep whole teams even when teams have good comp, well at least tangrowth >.>

 

1 hour ago, Monochrome_Complex said:

The gauntlet is very unfair, in how you're essentially fighting 3 bosses in a row, can't rearrange your team in between and have to start over each time. you fail, meaning your levels can get out of control quickly if you keep losing. And if you finish with a Z move you don't even get fully healed between fights due to a bug.

 

However in context of the story it makes sense and narratively does a good job in certifying how anna called you a "wrecking ball" earlier on. It's unfair but justifiably so.

 

I do hope the E4 doesn't pull the same thing though. 

 

FTR ditto arceus isn't that hard, especially if you have enough pokemon with bulldoze/earthquake lol. I think you can just collapse the field if all else fails, no? Get like 3 graveler with sturdy and spam bulldoze.

As long as you keep your mons alive in any way, they get healed, and by then you nearly overlevel the other gym leaders

 

 

2 hours ago, Candy said:

Reborn ain't just a game you fight trainers, leaders and evil team and that's it. It has a yuge emphasis on story. it wouldn't make sense to side with Radomus and then lose to El. El won't be like "aww you tried, good effort", he's going to be like "ha! now gimme that Ruby Ring you loser". If you side with El though, it makes sense that he should be a bit more considerate even if you lose, cause at least you supported him.

I can get that when looking at it like that. It’s just for some reason this is the only battle that didn’t sit right for me. I realized a little while ago, that this can apply to pretty much all pulse battles, the gauntlet battle, solaris 1st match but still this is the battle I hate the most from the factors. I’ll def be replaying this with everything in mind

Edited March 8, 2019 by L__Haze

[kithas]

1 hour ago, Candy said:

Reborn ain't just a game you fight trainers, leaders and evil team and that's it. It has a yuge emphasis on story. it wouldn't make sense to side with Radomus and then lose to El. El won't be like "aww you tried, good effort", he's going to be like "ha! now gimme that Ruby Ring you loser". If you side with El though, it makes sense that he should be a bit more considerate even if you lose, cause at least you supported him.

 

I think the same reasoning applies to the gauntlet too. You don't know what's happening while you've been hypnotized, but what really is happening is that three gym leaders have come rushing in to attempt to stop you. Of course they're going to use a lot of mons, in the hopes that if they battle you almost 3 vs 1, then you'll lose. It's a good plot point because it showcases the player's strength which is no longer match for the mid-tier gym leaders, but it requires much strategizing, which is also what Ame aims to make you do with the difficulty level of the game. Hope that even made sense, I'm half asleep lol

I think the gauntlet is unfair (I was specifically speaking about the 12vs6 battle but also applies to the whole thing), even if it is supposed to be and storywise it wouldn't be cool (and this wouldn't be Reborn) if it weren't. People are throwing at the MC everything they've got, they're not supposed to be fair. 

[Sirrobert]

Don't see this fight as a battle. See it as a puzzle. One that requires creative problem solving.

The easiest solution I found is to catch 4 gravelers with Sturdy, and bulldoze the cave into collapsing, KOing the Ditto. There are numerous other possible solutions.