The MC and our relations to the cast. Spoilers.

[Magus543]

So, considering the fact the dev team has friendzoned us with the entire Rejuv cast especially Melia, i want to use this chance to reflect on our relations with the cast. What do we mean to them? Are we really their friends, or just a tool to help them achieve victory? (Side note: I seriously find it hard to believe when designing this game and the cast, the dev team or at least Jan, never ONCE considered the dating mechanic, i mean really? Look at how waifu-ish half the ladies are in this game, especially Aelita and Nim. I've joked that at least Saki is Jan's own waifu, but hey, it's the Dev team's game and if they want to friendzone us and the cast, it's fine.)  Though is it just me, or does the confirmation that Melia apparently returns Venam's romantic love feel like a rejection of us? There is a reason why a certain majority of players thought the dev team was setting up a romance between us and Melia. I personally assumed that the dev team would have set a love triangle between us, Melia and Venam, but ehh it appears it's a love triangle between Ren, Melia, and Venam.

 

I personally feel that Ren and Aelita are our closest friends at this point, Aelita especially considering she's like the only person who's more our friend than Melia's friend unlike say Venam, Ren, and Kanon. Considering we have such great chemistry this patch, i'd rather hang out with them than Melia, especially considering she's got her new siblings, and a reunion with Venam to prioritize. (Disclaimer: I actually like Melia and don't consider her a mary sue, but it's clear we get along more with Ren and Aelita, at least to me, and she considers the people i listed to be more important to her.)  

 

Besides, Ren and Aelita, I would consider, Nim and Amber to be close to us. Amber in particular if you did her sidequest, plus i loved how she was genuinely trying to build a friendship with us and make amends for acting like a brat, before Venam rudely interrupted. She was totally cheering for us during the GDC Tournament, now that's a friend. Nim, because she saved us from falling back in blacksteeple, which was so unlike the rest of the NPCs who basically needed us to bail them out of problems, Nim felt like someone we could depend on and she GAVE US A BIKE AND TWISTED SPOON, i don't see other NPCs who gave us stuff like that. It's also interesting to note our PC is genuinely concerned when we reunite with Lorna. 

 

 

In regards to our enemies, sure Madam X killed our mom, but i like to imagine, Geara is our personal nemesis when it comes to Team Xen outside of the head honcho, Melia has Zetta, and Aelita has Madelis, but we have Geara. Geara almost kills our friends, then frames us, is the one who singles us out during a group fight in Terujuma, and is the one who kills us the first time on Valor mountain. Plus just as a reminder, he's the first Admin to personally come hunt us down.        

[LisiaImai]

honestly after replaying the game 3 times to try to get all the endings in the future, I don't see any implications of romance between you and the girls? It's clearly a platonic relationship the mc shares with everyone else and i'm certain it's meant to be that way. I think jan said in a q/a confirmed that he didn't want to write romance routes into the game bc it'd feel to harem-ish. personally I feel if the game were to have this in the future, it'd be problematic and esp cheesy af to create a potential romance option when theres no implications or buildups. there was actual proper buildup to address melia and venam's relationship and sm hints too (ep 10-12 is literally filled with notsosubtle hints; they sleep together on the same bed, and their reactions to seeing eachother, venam promising to be less selfish for melia, melia activating her god powers bc of her friendship w venam). if there was romance between the mc, it'd be like pulling a jk rowling and pandering to the community w meaningless fanservice

 

if there was romance then it'd be written in earlier. you're interpreting friendship as potential romance imo. . anyways feel free to have ur own intrepretations and headcannons but just note that the devs never intended to write in romance from the start

 

[Magus543]

12 minutes ago, LisiaImai said:

honestly after replaying the game 3 times to try to get all the endings in the future, I don't see any implications of romance between you and the girls? It's clearly a platonic relationship the mc shares with everyone else and i'm certain it's meant to be that way. I think jan said in a q/a confirmed that he didn't want to write romance routes into the game bc it'd feel to harem-ish. personally I feel if the game were to have this in the future, it'd be problematic and esp cheesy af to create a potential romance option when theres no implications or buildups. there was actual proper buildup to address melia and venam's relationship and sm hints too (ep 10-12 is literally filled with notsosubtle hints; they sleep together on the same bed, and their reactions to seeing eachother, venam promising to be less selfish for melia, melia activating her god powers bc of her friendship w venam). if there was romance between the mc, it'd be like pulling a jk rowling and pandering to the community w meaningless fanservice

 

if there was romance then it'd be written in earlier. you're interpreting friendship as potential romance imo. . anyways feel free to have ur own intrepretations and headcannons but just note that the devs never intended to write in romance from the start

 

Yeah this post was written in response to the Q/A the dev team had recently, I never considered the harem implication though. Each to their own as how we interpret our relationships with the NPCs as you say, though ironically i actually felt the part where Venam and Melia are in the same bed showed that their relationship was familial and platonic in nature, because the fact that they were able to sleep in the same bed with no shyness showed that they considered each other sisters because they grew up with each other but boy was i wrong. Though i considered Venam promising to be less selfish for Melia less because of a crush, and more because Venam was genuinely hurting people with how selfish she was like with Lenny and Lucia and growing up. 

 

EDIT: Also c'mon, Nim was totally flirting with us everytime we met up. Hell during the part where she acts all weird before Akuwa town, there is a part where she pretends to have a husband, then quickly states she doesn't have a husband. Though i think at this point, the dev team is probably going to reveal a familial connection with Nim and us. Please don't Dev team. 

Edited July 13, 2019 by Magus543

[Jan]

1 hour ago, Magus543 said:

So, considering the fact the dev team has friendzoned us with the entire Rejuv cast especially Melia, i want to use this chance to reflect on our relations with the cast. What do we mean to them? Are we really their friends, or just a tool to help them achieve victory? (Side note: I seriously find it hard to believe when designing this game and the cast, the dev team or at least Jan, never ONCE considered the dating mechanic, i mean really? Look at how waifu-ish half the ladies are in this game, especially Aelita and Nim. I've joked that at least Saki is Jan's own waifu, but hey, it's the Dev team's game and if they want to friendzone us and the cast, it's fine.)  Though is it just me, or does the confirmation that Melia apparently returns Venam's romantic love feel like a rejection of us? There is a reason why a certain majority of players thought the dev team was setting up a romance between us and Melia. I personally assumed that the dev team would have set a love triangle between us, Melia and Venam, but ehh it appears it's a love triangle between Ren, Melia, and Venam.

 

I personally feel that Ren and Aelita are our closest friends at this point, Aelita especially considering she's like the only person who's more our friend than Melia's friend unlike say Venam, Ren, and Kanon. Considering we have such great chemistry this patch, i'd rather hang out with them than Melia, especially considering she's got her new siblings, and a reunion with Venam to prioritize. (Disclaimer: I actually like Melia and don't consider her a mary sue, but it's clear we get along more with Ren and Aelita, at least to me, and she considers the people i listed to be more important to her.)  

 

Besides, Ren and Aelita, I would consider, Nim and Amber to be close to us. Amber in particular if you did her sidequest, plus i loved how she was genuinely trying to build a friendship with us and make amends for acting like a brat, before Venam rudely interrupted. She was totally cheering for us during the GDC Tournament, now that's a friend. Nim, because she saved us from falling back in blacksteeple, which was so unlike the rest of the NPCs who basically needed us to bail them out of problems, Nim felt like someone we could depend on and she GAVE US A BIKE AND TWISTED SPOON, i don't see other NPCs who gave us stuff like that. It's also interesting to note our PC is genuinely concerned when we reunite with Lorna. 

 

 

In regards to our enemies, sure Madam X killed our mom, but i like to imagine, Geara is our personal nemesis when it comes to Team Xen outside of the head honcho, Melia has Zetta, and Aelita has Madelis, but we have Geara. Geara almost kills our friends, then frames us, is the one who singles us out during a group fight in Terujuma, and is the one who kills us the first time on Valor mountain. Plus just as a reminder, he's the first Admin to personally come hunt us down.        

A dating mechanic was never considered. Just because a cast is primarily female doesn't mean they're there for people's fetishization. 

I'm not here to ruin anyone's head-canons, because you do you, but just because a girl is nice to you doesn't mean they're attracted to you in any way. 

 

Ngl, the fact that people see Melia and Venam's thing as a "rejection" is really weird. I have never done anything to personally go after the player or put them in a bad spot. Despite what players think when it comes to the Mega Ring.

 

Also none of the girls are my waifu because I'm not attracted to women.

[Cyphre]

Just a thought, but it doesnt have to be dating per se. There are a lot of games that had personal quests for characters, and later off allowed you to take this chosen character into the last fight or be the one to save you e.t.c., thus allowing to do epilogues with them. Naming one good example is Mana Khemia series. For example, if you pick one guy, after the events of the game you go and become a partner-mercenary, or you can instead retire to the woods and lead a quite life, or pursue infinite studies with your rival. I think this is the kind of system Rejuvenation could benefit from. 

Again, i am not in any way telling Jan how to deal with his game, but i want to throw this as an idea, which, i think, would work well within the already constructed plot. 

[Zumi]

the fact that you feel like you're entitled to date a fictional character says more about you than us not adding that feature in the game..... it's not a dating sim. it never was gonna be a dating sim. idk why you're going into a pokemon game expecting it to be a dating sim when it's not even part of the maingame series. the characters do not exist for the sole purpose of thirsting over. like jan already said in his post, just because a character is nice to you does not mean they're attracted to you, because yknow, friends exist! relationships are not inherently romantic and can be platonic too.

 

 

[Gheist]

4 hours ago, Jan said:

Just because a cast is primarily female doesn't mean they're there for people's fetishization. 

Oh come on, you don't have to put it that way. Simply wanting a romantic route with a character doesn't mean we're fetishizng them. Literally nobody here is asking you to make an eroge.

[Sardines]

37 minutes ago, Gheist said:

Oh come on, you don't have to put it that way. Simply wanting a romantic route with a character doesn't mean we're fetishizng them. Literally nobody here is asking you to make an eroge.

Given how repeatedly ppl ask for it, even when Jan says he wouldn't be doing it, you gotta wonder. It's not exactly like the "I want romance options" bunch is a silent group. Especially with how big a deal it is being considered since Jan putting it in final terms that it's something he is definitely not comfortable with doing. It's not the type of story he wants to make neither an element that he wants to put into the story that he is making

[Jan]

37 minutes ago, Gheist said:

Oh come on, you don't have to put it that way. Simply wanting a romantic route with a character doesn't mean we're fetishizng them. Literally nobody here is asking you to make an eroge.

Correct. Notice how I didn't specifically comment towards the OP of the thread or anyone in particular. It was a general statement. As the game's creator I notice a lot more talk about this sort of stuff. I've seen what people have said about the female characters and it's straight up gross. Wanting a romantic route is fine. I don't have a problem with that, but for people to repeatedly ask when I said no is just annoying. 

[interdiction]

The repeated use of the term "friendzone" is gross and implies the characters are entitled to be your romantic partner (likely because they are female, though I won't put words in other people's mouths to be inflammatory). Especially because some of these characters likely don't have attraction to men (though I won't erase the possiblity of them being bi/pan.) Also, asexual/aromantic people (not me, I just use the general term "queer" to refer to myself as I don't particularly identify with any label of sexuality, but I am friends with people who are) play games too. Waifu culture is absolutely exhausting when so many games already pander to people thirsty for anime girls and make it sound weird if you're not. Seeing a game that doesn't is refreshing. (And, many of these characters are barely 18 if they are 18 or over. Also kinda skeevy.)

Edited July 14, 2019 by interdiction

[Gheist]

57 minutes ago, Jan said:

Correct. Notice how I didn't specifically comment towards the OP of the thread or anyone in particular. It was a general statement. As the game's creator I notice a lot more talk about this sort of stuff. I've seen what people have said about the female characters and it's straight up gross.

I have not personally encountered anyone doing that but I'll take your word for it that they exist and sure, fuck those people. But since you were directly responding to a thread/post not doing that, it looked like you were addressing it to all of us wanting romantic routes in general.

Although if people want to make a thread or comment that they would like to see X in the game, I don't see the problem. We're just giving feedback. You can take it into consideration or not.

[Alisae]

dating shouldn't be the main focus of any pokemon game

period

it just wouldn't make sense

ik in the cannon world you're saying 10 year olds should date other 10 year olds or whatever

[Enigma Shot U]

The way this game is set up with all the characters and seeing a lot of them develop in ways you wouldn’t nessecarily expect, I can see how the idea comes to head. It’s only natural to wonder/think about possibly exploring a deeper bond with some of them. I can also understand not wanting to pollute the story with romance for if done incorrectly, it can really deteriorate the quality of this game’s story. Not to mention that while there are a plethora of female characters, there aren’t many male characters, which wouldn’t really be fair to people not looking to romance a female.

[interdiction]

8 minutes ago, Gheist said:

I have not personally encountered anyone doing that but I'll take your word for it that they exist and sure, fuck those people. But since you were directly responding to a thread/post not doing that, it looked like you were addressing it to all of us wanting romantic routes in general.

Although if people want to make a thread or comment that they would like to see X in the game, I don't see the problem. We're just giving feedback. You can take it into consideration or not.

The issue is that he has. He said no, never. It gets repetitive, at least in that instance. Asking for features is fine if it's done politely, but asking for something already said that will never, ever be in the game is going to get on the devs' nerves. 

[Gheist]

5 minutes ago, interdiction said:

The issue is that he has. He said no, never. It gets repetitive, at least in that instance. Asking for features is fine if it's done politely, but asking for something already said that will never, ever be in the game is going to get on the devs' nerves.  

From what I've seen it is done politely or at least not in a rude way. But yea, feedback is gonna get repetitive the more people you have playing the game and noticing/wanting certain things. That is just how this works. Also not all of these threads are even asking Jan directly to do anything. "Would you like to see romantic routes in the game - poll" and then it's just people discussing amongst themselves. If the topic doesn't interest you, just don't click the thread.

Now if people are actually PM-ing him every day with "Implement a romantic route with Aelita you *****" then by all means that's not appropriate.

 

Btw, "friendzoning" just means you want to date the girl/guy but they just want to be friends with you. It doesn't mean you're entitled to their affection or that you think they owe you anything.

It's just something that happens a lot and people came up with a word for it. I see no reason why anybody should be offended by it.

[Alisae]

now

if this was Pokemon Rejuvenation the musical

then we would be talkin

[interdiction]

35 minutes ago, Gheist said:

From what I've seen it is done politely or at least not in a rude way. But yea, feedback is gonna get repetitive the more people you have playing the game and noticing/wanting certain things. That is just how this works. Also not all of these threads are even asking Jan directly to do anything. "Would you like to see romantic routes in the game - poll" and then it's just people discussing amongst themselves. If the topic doesn't interest you, just don't click the thread.

Now if people are actually PM-ing him every day with "Implement a romantic route with Aelita you *****" then by all means that's not appropriate.

 

Btw, "friendzoning" just means you want to date the girl/guy but they just want to be friends with you. It doesn't mean you're entitled to their affection or that you think they owe you anything.

It's just something that happens a lot and people came up with a word for it. I see no reason why anybody should be offended by it.

Yeah, I'm not implying people are harassing him to add it, more that people seemed to fixate on it, and/or some of them may not have seen his statement. You had worded your post (mostly the "take into consideration") part in a way that came off to me like he has to be open to changing his mind or listening to repeat suggestions, which is why I had gotten somewhat aggressive in tone. 

 

As for the word "friendzone", I almost always see it used in that context (in general, not specifically here) so I'm going to react negatively to it, though I don't want to argue about it further on the forums and ignite a flame war. I don't have enough knowledge personally to speak on the topic anyway.

[Magus543]

Oh wow, i made a thread where both Zumi and Jan reacted, this is so cool. '' Ahem '' Sorry if this post made me sound entitled or anything, really love your game, i just wanted to make a thread discussing this particular element, but really i just wanted to discuss how we as the MC are in relation to the rest of  the cast. but then it spiraled to this, whoops. EDIT: also i was using friendzone as a clumsy joke, double whoops.

7 hours ago, Jan said:

A dating mechanic was never considered. Just because a cast is primarily female doesn't mean they're there for people's fetishization. 

I'm not here to ruin anyone's head-canons, because you do you, but just because a girl is nice to you doesn't mean they're attracted to you in any way. 

 

Ngl, the fact that people see Melia and Venam's thing as a "rejection" is really weird. I have never done anything to personally go after the player or put them in a bad spot. Despite what players think when it comes to the Mega Ring.

 

Also none of the girls are my waifu because I'm not attracted to women.

oh. Now i really made myself look like a jackass, sorry. I'm actually pretty cool with no romance as long as we get to hang out with the cast more. Like i said, in the first post, it's fine if there are no romance sidequests for us, at least it won't get in the way of the main plot. 

6 hours ago, Zumi said:

the fact that you feel like you're entitled to date a fictional character says more about you than us not adding that feature in the game..... it's not a dating sim. it never was gonna be a dating sim. idk why you're going into a pokemon game expecting it to be a dating sim when it's not even part of the maingame series. the characters do not exist for the sole purpose of thirsting over. like jan already said in his post, just because a character is nice to you does not mean they're attracted to you, because yknow, friends exist! relationships are not inherently romantic and can be platonic too.

 

 

Ouch, now Zumi's giving me a burn. Yeah i will admit, IRL i'm kinda of an idiot and young when it comes to these sort of things, but i hope i have made it clear that i was trying to be joking throughout this post, but guess i just sound like a wierdo. I dunno, maybe because this game was more anime-ish than what the main games are, and i guess i played myself when assuming the dev team would use certain tropes, ah well, live and learn. Like i said i'm fine with no romance route in this game. 

 

 

Regardless, thank you both for your thoughts, and sorry if i offended any of you. I don't want to end up on the dev teams shit list. or really anyone elses.   

Edited July 14, 2019 by Magus543

[Gheist]

22 minutes ago, interdiction said:

Yeah, I'm not implying people are harassing him to add it, more that people seemed to fixate on it, and/or some of them may not have seen his statement. You had worded your post (mostly the "take into consideration") part in a way that came off to me like he has to be open to changing his mind or listening to repeat suggestions, which is why I had gotten somewhat aggressive in tone. 

Well I can only speak for myself but I've been following the game for some 5 years now and have just learned a few days ago that Jan's this adamantly said that there won't be any romance. Until then I just thought "Maybe he'll include it, maybe not. Lets wait and see." But now that I see he apparently doesn't like this brought up, I probably won't bring it up again (at least not for a good while) although I may still engage in the discussion if someone else does. We're still allowed to discuss these things even if it doesn't end up being canon.

 

As for the friendzone thing, it's fine if you don't want to talk about it further but just keep in mind that the next time you see it used, the person using it might not mean anything insulting by it. That is all.

 

@Magus543 Dude you really don't need to prostrate yourself like this. You're entitled to your opinion, they're entitled to disagree. You've said literally nothing that sounded entitled or even questionable and in my humble opinion, they are overreacting probably because they're tired of seeing people bring this up and are conflating you with the entire mob. It's very clear to me that you were just trying to have some fun and talk about the game but they seem to have taken it as some kind of attack.

 

And you're DEFINITELY not being stupid for seeing the romantic undertones in Rejuvenation whether they were intentional or not. If that many girls are being that friendly towards you, you'd be an idiot for not considering that some of them might be interested in your romantically. Don't be the dense harem protagonist that needs a girl to spell it out for them in large capital letters. Even if none of them thought of you that way, there's nothing wrong with trying to pursue them anyway and maybe they'll end up liking you now that the idea has been planted in their head.

I get that you're trying to appease the devs now because they seem above human at least on these forums but you really did nothing wrong here and you are also not the only one with this opinion. Don't let their harsh response make you think otherwise.

[WewLad]

Just now, Jan said:

Correct. Notice how I didn't specifically comment towards the OP of the thread or anyone in particular. It was a general statement. As the game's creator I notice a lot more talk about this sort of stuff. I've seen what people have said about the female characters and it's straight up gross. Wanting a romantic route is fine. I don't have a problem with that, but for people to repeatedly ask when I said no is just annoying. 

Aww man, I was really hoping to get a route with the piano lady fug

[Jan]

36 minutes ago, Gheist said:

Well I can only speak for myself but I've been following the game for some 5 years now and have just learned a few days ago that Jan's this adamantly said that there won't be any romance. Until then I just thought "Maybe he'll include it, maybe not. Lets wait and see." But now that I see he apparently doesn't like this brought up, I probably won't bring it up again (at least not for a good while) although I may still engage in the discussion if someone else does. We're still allowed to discuss these things even if it doesn't end up being canon.

 

As for the friendzone thing, it's fine if you don't want to talk about it further but just keep in mind that the next time you see it used, the person using it might not mean anything insulting by it. That is all.

 

@Magus543 Dude you really don't need to prostrate yourself like this. You're entitled to your opinion, they're entitled to disagree. You've said literally nothing that sounded entitled or even questionable and in my humble opinion, they are overreacting probably because they're tired of seeing people bring this up and are conflating you with the entire mob. It's very clear to me that you were just trying to have some fun and talk about the game but they seem to have taken it as some kind of attack.

 

And you're DEFINITELY not being stupid for seeing the romantic undertones in Rejuvenation whether they were intentional or not. If that many girls are being that friendly towards you, you'd be an idiot for not considering that some of them might be interested in your romantically. Don't be the dense harem protagonist that needs a girl to spell it out for them in large capital letters. Even if none of them thought of you that way, there's nothing wrong with trying to pursue them anyway and maybe they'll end up liking you now that the idea has been planted in their head.

I get that you're trying to appease the devs now because they seem above human at least on these forums but you really did nothing wrong here and you are also not the only one with this opinion. Don't let their harsh response make you think otherwise.

An attack? Who's the one overreacting now? I said my piece and left, that's it. This isn't some pitchfork mob at your doorstep waiting for you to make one wrong move to justify a comeback. I don't condone harassment. You're allowed to agree or disagree with me, I'm not going to fight you on this. But my point still stands and that's just that.