V13 Discussion Thread

[kithas]

Well I would say that a "reward system for unlocking gameplay achievements" does already exist in Rejuvenation. At the least it could be implemented there. I think getting the whole pokédex can well be an actual achievement on itself, too, but I think getting something out of it can be a good incentive  

[Draconis]

It just occurred to me, how will we evolve Koffing into G-Weezing? Will there be like a special item or something?

[Zumi]

3 minutes ago, Draconis said:

It just occurred to me, how will we evolve Koffing into G-Weezing? Will there be like a special item or something?

G-Weezing will be location based evolution!

[Meruem]

12 minutes ago, Zumi said:

G-Weezing will be location based evolution!

Placing my bets on Grand Dream City / Gearen City (and each of their surroundings)

[Gastronely]

31 minutes ago, Gore said:

Placing my bets on Grand Dream City / Gearen City (and each of their surroundings)

No. It will evolve in the Dimmsdale Dimmadome

[ArcBolt27]

6 hours ago, Gore said:

Placing my bets on Grand Dream City / Gearen City (and each of their surroundings)

west gearn would be most fitting tbh

[SadMoney]

On 6/29/2020 at 1:28 AM, Jan said:

All Pokemon will be obtained at some point. 

you press dragon dance once and win any battle in this game.

 

Either way I've stated multiple times (It's even on the download page) that all Pokemon will eventually be able to be caught. After all the Pokemon that are available now and with still a handful of versions left... It'd be really weird if I just left out some Pokemon just cause?? I don't really get that conclusion, but i digress.

 

 

Keep Gyarados out until end game.

 

No opponents can deal with Moxie + DD + 540bst + good lvl up movepool

 

Gyara can 6-0 too many teams with 0 team support

[Myrrh]

2 hours ago, SadMoney said:

Keep Gyarados out until end game.

 

No opponents can deal with Moxie + DD + 540bst + good lvl up movepool

 

Gyara can 6-0 too many teams with 0 team support

Volcarona has Quiver Dance and can abuse it to be even more absurd.  Even in competitive it's a larger threat than Gyarados even despite the prevalence of Stealth Rock to keep it in check.  In fact, it's usually mentioned by Smogon as a reason they keep Stealth Rock around as it could very well be banned otherwise.  (This isn't the only reason of course, but it is a notable one all the same.)  One can also abuse Fiery Dance to get a boost from using that as well.

 

252 SpA Volcarona Fiery Dance vs. 240 HP / 40 SpD Arceus: 111-132 (25.1 - 29.9%) -- guaranteed 4HKO

+1 252 SpA Volcarona Fiery Dance vs. 240 HP / 40 SpD Arceus: 166-196 (37.6 - 44.4%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

+2 252 SpA Volcarona Fiery Dance vs. 240 HP / 40 SpD Arceus: 222-262 (50.3 - 59.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

 

Lilligant is quite honestly underrated when it goes against game AI as it can power through most singles related sections simply through abusing Quiver Dance and Sleep Powder.  It's not as reliable as the other two, but she does brute force really well.

 

Salamence (which is available to a select people who helped Jan out before), is just as bad as Gyarados and its mega is among the most broken Pokemon in the game.  Worth mentioning as we'll be getting megas available in version 13.  But we'll probably not have this particular mega until later I suppose.

 

Blaziken with Speed Boost is a lot more broken than Gyarados and you can get this from the start.  Doesn't even need its mega, which just makes it even better.

 

Greninja has protean and hits as hard as Deoxys Attack with Ice Beam.

 

252 SpA Life Orb Protean Greninja Ice Beam vs. 240 HP / 0 SpD Arceus: 140-165 (31.7 - 37.4%) -- 86.9% chance to 3HKO

252 SpA Life Orb Deoxys-Attack Ice Beam vs. 240 HP / 0 SpD Arceus: 139-165 (31.5 - 37.4%) -- 87.4% chance to 3HKO

 

We also have Life Orb available at this point as well.

 

Lucario's mega is another broken Pokemon that'll be available given Adaptability Close Combat, Adaptability Bullet Punch, and Swords Dance.

 

252 Atk Adaptability Lucario-Mega Close Combat vs. 240 HP / 40 Def Arceus-Dragon: 236-278 (53.5 - 63%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

+2 252 Atk Adaptability Lucario-Mega Close Combat vs. 240 HP / 40 Def Arceus-Dragon: 468-552 (106.1 - 125.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO

252 Atk Gyarados Waterfall vs. 240 HP / 40 Def Arceus: 106-126 (24 - 28.5%) -- 97% chance to 4HKO

+1 252 Atk Gyarados Waterfall vs. 240 HP / 40 Def Arceus: 157-186 (35.6 - 42.1%) -- guaranteed 3HKO (Assuming a dance)

+2 252 Atk Gyarados Waterfall vs. 240 HP / 40 Def Arceus: 211-249 (47.8 - 56.4%) -- 85.5% chance to 2HKO (Assuming a dance and Moxie boost)

 

Rillaboom doesn't even need calculations or anything else as Grassy Surge is enough to break the game outside opponents able to change the terrain from it.  (Just be happy it isn't Psychic Surge as that'd break the game even more.)

 

Cinderace is another Protean user with Libero.

 

Pelipper + Mega Swampert will be just as effective ingame as it is in Gen 7 OU.  One could even make a whole rain team effectively with this.

 

Zygarde isn't much right now, but the moment we can get 50% form he'll be broken as well with his combined bulk, Thousand Arrows, Glare, and all his buff options.

 

Again, Gyarados really is not that broken, especially when we have plenty of other things to look at to compare it to.  People just look at him in a vacuum, see all its positives, and then think it's broken or too powerful, but it really isn't.  This isn't even everything you could be comparing it with either.  I also want to reaffirm that double battles also aren't as easily broken with a single sweeper due to the mechanics of it.

[SadMoney]

4 minutes ago, Myrrh said:

Volcarona has Quiver Dance and can abuse it to be even more absurd.  Even in competitive it's a larger threat than Gyarados even despite the prevalence of Stealth Rock to keep it in check.  In fact, it's usually mentioned by Smogon as a reason they keep Stealth Rock around as it could very well be banned otherwise.  One can also abuse Fiery Dance to get a boost from using that as well.

 

252 SpA Volcarona Fiery Dance vs. 240 HP / 40 SpD Arceus: 111-132 (25.1 - 29.9%) -- guaranteed 4HKO

+1 252 SpA Volcarona Fiery Dance vs. 240 HP / 40 SpD Arceus: 166-196 (37.6 - 44.4%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

+2 252 SpA Volcarona Fiery Dance vs. 240 HP / 40 SpD Arceus: 222-262 (50.3 - 59.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

 

Lilligant is quite honestly underrated when it goes against game AI as it can power through most singles related sections simply through abusing Quiver Dance and Sleep Powder.  It's not as reliable as the other two, but she does brute force really well.

 

Salamence (which is available to a select people who helped Jan out before), is just as bad as Gyarados and its mega is among the most broken Pokemon in the game.  Worth mentioning as we'll be getting megas available in version 13.  But we'll probably not have this particular mega until later I suppose.

 

Blaziken with Speed Boost is a lot more broken than Gyarados and you can get this from the start.  Doesn't even need its mega, which just makes it even better.

 

Greninja has protean and hits as hard as Deoxys Attack with Ice Beam.

 

252 SpA Life Orb Protean Greninja Ice Beam vs. 240 HP / 0 SpD Arceus: 140-165 (31.7 - 37.4%) -- 86.9% chance to 3HKO

252 SpA Life Orb Deoxys-Attack Ice Beam vs. 240 HP / 0 SpD Arceus: 139-165 (31.5 - 37.4%) -- 87.4% chance to 3HKO

 

We also have Life Orb available at this point as well.

 

Lucario's mega is another broken Pokemon that'll be available given Adaptability Close Combat, Adaptability Bullet Punch, and Swords Dance.

 

252 Atk Adaptability Lucario-Mega Close Combat vs. 252 HP / 40 Def Arceus-Dragon: 236-278 (53.1 - 62.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

+2 252 Atk Adaptability Lucario-Mega Close Combat vs. 252 HP / 40 Def Arceus-Dragon: 468-552 (105.4 - 124.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO

252 Atk Gyarados Waterfall vs. 252 HP / 40 Def Arceus-Dragon: 53-63 (11.9 - 14.1%) -- possible 8HKO

252 Atk Gyarados Waterfall vs. 240 HP / 40 Def Arceus: 106-126 (24 - 28.5%) -- 97% chance to 4HKO

+1 252 Atk Gyarados Waterfall vs. 240 HP / 40 Def Arceus: 157-186 (35.6 - 42.1%) -- guaranteed 3HKO (Assuming a dance)

+2 252 Atk Gyarados Waterfall vs. 240 HP / 40 Def Arceus: 211-249 (47.8 - 56.4%) -- 85.5% chance to 2HKO (Assuming a dance and Moxie boost)

 

Rillaboom doesn't even need calculations or anything else as Grassy Surge is enough to break the game outside opponents able to change the terrain from it.  (Just be happy it isn't Psychic Surge as that'd break the game even more.)

 

Cinderace is another Protean user with Libero.

 

Pelliper + Mega Swampert will be just as effective ingame as it is in Gen 7 OU.  One could even make a whole rain team effectively with this.

 

Zygarde isn't much right now, but the moment we can get 50% form he'll be broken as well with his combined bulk, thousand arrows, glare, and all his buff options.

 

Again, Gyarados really is not that broken, especially when we have plenty of other things to look at to compare it to.  People just look at him in a vacuum, see all its positives, and then think it's broken or too powerful, but it really isn't.  This isn't even everything you could be comparing it with either.  I also want to reaffirm that double battles also aren't as easily broken with a single sweeper due to the mechanics of it.

This isnt smogon. In rejuvenation in-game plays out way different than competitive. Otherwise you would see people spamming toxapex and skarmory to get through battles.

 

Your examples make no sense:

 

Volcarona is mystery egg, evolves at lvl 60, has no coverage moves, and gets anhihilated by the plethora of lycanrocs/other rock coverage moves throughout in game.

 

Greninja, again, has no coverage moves, absolutre garbage lvl up movepool and does nothing until mid-late game, and can never sweep a team due to lack of boosts. How are you getting ice beam on greninja? There is no tm for it.

 

Salamence? How the did you get that?

 

Blaziken doesnt have moxie, so it cant sweep with impunity like gyara. Although this mon is broken

 

Gyara should be made available at the same time you mention all those super powerful megas come out. So maybe like 15+ badges?

[Chrixai]

Ok I'm sorry, but can we please move onto another topic? It's really not a big deal as Jan said all mons will be available soon. And I'm sure Gyarados/Magikarp will be available soon. So can we discuss something else? Likeeeeeee the hype and longer content v13 has to offer.

[Myrrh]

1 hour ago, SadMoney said:

This isnt smogon. In rejuvenation in-game plays out way different than competitive. Otherwise you would see people spamming toxapex and skarmory to get through battles.

 

Your examples make no sense:

 

Volcarona is mystery egg, evolves at lvl 60, has no coverage moves, and gets anhihilated by the plethora of lycanrocs/other rock coverage moves throughout in game.

 

Greninja, again, has no coverage moves, absolutre garbage lvl up movepool and does nothing until mid-late game, and can never sweep a team due to lack of boosts. How are you getting ice beam on greninja? There is no tm for it.

 

Salamence? How the did you get that?

 

Blaziken doesnt have moxie, so it cant sweep with impunity like gyara. Although this mon is broken

 

Gyara should be made available at the same time you mention all those super powerful megas come out. So maybe like 15+ badges?

It doesn't need to be Smogon to apply calculations and power scaling to a Pokemon.  I am well aware how ingame works as well considering I've played through the whole game, but that hardly means anything.  Ingame is a lot easier than competitive due to AI requiring unfair advantages to pose any similar amount of threat.  So Volcarona not having to worry about Stealth Rock outside of the few instances of AI using it does matter here as it gives times for it to setup at max health vs half health.  This matters as both Gyarados and Volcarona aren't going to be boosting in front of a Pokemon that can't damage them every single time.  (Volcarona also has access to Roost to allow it to abuse setup better than Gyarados in some instances.  Quiver Dance boosting Special Defense also helps it be able to boost when faced with special attackers.)

 

My examples make perfect sense considering all of these are generally available to the player, whereas Gyarados is currently not available due to the false pre-tense that it is broken.

 

Volcarona can be gotten from doing a puzzle in the game.  It has Quiver Dance, Fiery Dance, Hurricane, Bug Buzz, and Substitute.  This is all it needs.  Lycanroc is irrelevant as not every trainer has one and it isn't nearly as common as you try to make it out to be.  Same Pokemon also does around 50%~ or more damage to Gyarados as well with Accelerock, which could very well faint it, and outright kills it with Stone Edge.

 

Greninja has no coverage?  You're joking right?  We have Dark Pulse and Surf available ingame as of now for it, Water Shuriken from move relearner for water priority, Grass Knot and Blizzard for other types you'd need.  It isn't as powerful as it is in competitive right now, but to say it has "no coverage" is an exaggeration.  Gyarados itself only really has Waterfall (or Aqua Tail), Crunch, and Ice Fang for the most part.

 

Salamence was given out to those who had helped Jan as I stated before.

 

Blaziken doesn't need Moxie, but you already admitted that this is broken so moving on.

 

You haven't explained why for this.  You just say it's broken and don't bring anything of substance as to why outside vacuum numbers.  You also downplayed both Volcarona (by dismissing Smogon points because "not competitive") and Greninja by saying they have no coverage options, showing you really don't understand how these two work.

 

57 minutes ago, Chrixai said:

Ok I'm sorry, but can we please move onto another topic? It's really not a big deal as Jan said all mons will be available soon. And I'm sure Gyarados/Magikarp will be available soon. So can we discuss something else? Likeeeeeee the hype and longer content v13 has to offer.

Fair enough.  I'm looking forward to the gen 8 Pokemon being in the game as well as the new teams all the characters and NPCs will have.

[SadMoney]

How are terrain altering abilities being handled in V13?

 

Any of those abilities pretty much invalidate most gym leader strategy with no setup required.

 

 

[OmegaStellarSolare]

Oh no. I forgot to tell about the remaining Star Shard because currently there has 4 star shards obtainable. Maybe I acted too late about that now that the debeloppment has been improved. I really screwed this time.

[MhicKy]

Damn, guys.. Calm down..

Listen, Gyarados for a game like Rejuvenation IS quite OP, Gyarados has a very strong sweep potential and since this isn't online matches and the AI can be abused (I sure done that a lot..) it's easy to set up a Gyarados for a quick sweep, I mean, most players see that coming but AI trainers? Nah..

About the terrain, I don't think anything need to be changed, it's true that most of the difficulty of fighting a gym leader is fighting his team on a setup that is advantageous to them like Crawli having a Forest Field AND infinite Rain (weakening Fire Types, nullifying one of his team's weakness) but honestly speaking we kinda already can manipulate fields to our advantage even before those moves.. My strategy against Souta is basically start with a Steelix with Smack Down to turn the Air Field into a Mountain Top Field and then Dig to turn the Mountain Top Field into a Cave Field and just sweep with Lycanroc afterwards, so I don't think anything needs to be changed tbh

[Myrrh]

1 hour ago, MhicKy said:

My strategy

This is exactly the reason why a terrain setter like Rillaboom breaks the mechanic.  It replaces strategy of using moves to change them to your own advantage with just sending out Rillaboom and being done with it.  It essentially lets you just bypass the whole thing outside occasions where the opponent happens to have moves to take back control.

[Edo]

5 hours ago, Myrrh said:

This is exactly the reason why a terrain setter like Rillaboom breaks the mechanic.  It replaces strategy of using moves to change them to your own advantage with just sending out Rillaboom and being done with it.  It essentially lets you just bypass the whole thing outside occasions where the opponent happens to have moves to take back control.

hmm.. I think I read somewhere that for V13, the four original terrains will be separate from the fanmade fields introduced in Reborn and Rejuvenation, so basically they would stack.
For example, let's say setting the Grassy terrain (only 2 effects: Grass +50% damage and heal every turn) on top of the Factory field (with its countless effects).
I might be remembering wrong tho, but that would definitely be the best way to balance out the field moves/abilities.

[OmegaStellarSolare]

I hate to say it but can we stop talking about that part because I don't want for V13 discussion thread to be closed and I don't want to be a part of that.

Anyway, there's something I have to say. I must understand that those choices in Rejuvenation affects the dialogues. But now in V13, will those dialogues remain the same regardless of choices (like when Melia defeat Madelis or not, when MC defends Officer from Rift Gardevoir or attempting to save Maria, etc...)?

Edited July 3, 2020 by RoyChaos

[MhicKy]

Anyway let's just not get things get very heat up, yeah? Is just game

@Jan
Also, another question that isn't exactly for V13 but actually when the game is done and the story complete, do you intend to allow the player to do rematches against every single gym leader again but this time they all would had Lv100 teams? Just something I always wish I could do in the main series tbh

Also, congratulations on getting the game at 63%!
Oh boi, oh boi!!

Edited July 5, 2020 by MhicKy
Typos

[Abyawb]

Hey what's gonna happen to saki. we know what happens to valarie and adam but wut abou her.

my first rejuv team:

Delphox, talonflame, nidoqueen, sylveon, empoleon, and venusaur

my shiny locke rejuv team (at the moment): in hard mode

silvally, greninja,nidoking, pyroar, decidueye, and espeon.

espeon with psych up is a beast.

 

Edited July 4, 2020 by Death lord

[Abyawb]

we may get the games quicker than we think

 

[ArcBolt27]

53 minutes ago, Death lord said:

we may get the games quicker than we think

 

not to sound rude but dont make assumptions especially when it comes to stuff like this without any evidence to back up the claims u provide..........................  i say this because ur not the first person to claim this and likely not the last

[Draconis]

A couple questions regarding TMs:

1. I noticed on the wiki that there's a TM104 Douse. What is that move and when will it be available, if at all?

2. How many TMs do you intend to put in the game by the final version?

3. Do you intend to make Breaking Swipe a TM?

Sorry if these have been asked before.

Edited July 5, 2020 by Draconis

[Sardines]

7 hours ago, Draconis said:

A couple questions regarding TMs:

1. I noticed on the wiki that there's a TM104 Douse. What is that move and when will it be available, if at all?

2. How many TMs do you intend to put in the game by the final version?

3. Do you intend to make Breaking Swipe a TM?

Sorry if these have been asked before.

No need to be sorry if a question has been asked before. Can't expect to read through all previous questions in all threads for every obscure question.
Jan can probably come in and give a proper answer but from what I know

1. If it's on the wiki, take it with a grain of salt. It has a lot of very outdated information. Such as Douse being a move that used to be in the game but now it's an unused move (no one uses it at the moment)
2. There isn't any real number decided for "how many TMs intend to put in game by final version". We'll know when we get to the final version
3. Can't say anything on this. Mainly cause not everything is finalized

[BRS swag]

16 hours ago, Draconis said:

I noticed on the wiki that there's a TM104 Douse. What is that move and when will it be available, if at all?

This TM was a move which was present back in V8 and I believe it holds no significance as of now. 

[ArcBolt27]

the field effect system could be interesting with moves like breaking swipe imo plus with it being a base sword/shield move and some mons already in rejuv are capable of learning it iirc i dont see it being completely out of the realm of possibility and correct me if im wrong but we havent fought the dragon leader yet right? if not they could be a perfect means of obtaining it