Theory Crafting Thread

[enderowl]

I was thinking back on the Melia is Maria theory and was pondering on somethings. I know this theory has some flaws to it (especially the part were Maria is great at mathematics and Melia is atrocious at it), but I was wondering if Melia was one part of Maria's personality.

 

What if Melia, Erin, Allen, and Alice are all just different parts of Maria.

 

I may be jumping the gun since it has been some time that I last played the game, but I would believe that Erin is the one who is great at mathematics due to her going to the library in GDC. (I do want to clarify that I don't know if Erin is good at math, I'm just making some assumptions)

I don't know what Allen and Alice would be for Maria's personality though.

[R.A.M CXZ 007]

maybe it is not true but i dont think maria is melia are same people because do u remember dufaux quest the two narcy

was barely existing together so both melia and maria has existed in a same time period for more than 2 or 3 yrs i will not back it up but it is a possibility

 

[Display name]

Since Cera is a maid it could be possible that she's based off of cella

[R.A.M CXZ 007]

what do you think the dream yard area's importance

[CrystalStar]

6 hours ago, ramnarayans said:

what do you think the dream yard area's importance

most probably the place we fight cosmet and cosmia

 

Edited June 1, 2021 by CrystalStar

[CrystalStar]

so uh....
do you guys think that the zygarde sidquest could affect the main story?

[TheHellHamster]

I think so. The fourth part of the Hidden Library quest chain had the same style of choice that we saw in the bad future so I'm thinking it probably has some effect on the ending you can get. This would set precedent for sidequests and main story mixing. With how important the other two of the XYZ trio seem to be and the similarities between the Interceptor and Zygarde it would be odd for it not to affect the main stroy somehow.

[0 SPD Slowpoke]

On 5/26/2021 at 4:10 AM, O0mega said:

So touching on the Madame X being Melia, Maria, or anything along those lines. In the archive under..route 6? The one where it speaks about the interceptor's core. In the bottom right corner theres a book speaking about the Archetype's Influence which notes those who are "possessed" gain golden eyes, skin and hair. Which makes sense with Melia being blond along with her siblings. It also mentions that those who have the power removed have their original appearance restored. So maybe Madame X did have that power in one way and another then lost it which caused her hair to be..black? Its been awhile since I finished the pyramid fight.

Remember that according to the hospital reports, Anathea (Maria's mother) is stated to have black hair. Madame X is 100% a Melia of some kind, or I'm tattooing Melia's face on my asscheeks.

[R.A.M CXZ 007]

its a possibilty but why did'nt the boss of a really powerful and resourceful crime syndicate would choose not to overlap

alternate self to become more powerful while she had the chance its possible madam x could be some one related to Melia

(But dont shrug the possibility you said thats why speculation are for)

 

[CrystalStar]

15 hours ago, 0 SPD Slowpoke said:

Remember that according to the hospital reports, Anathea (Maria's mother) is stated to have black hair. Madame X is 100% a Melia of some kind, or I'm tattooing Melia's face on my asscheeks.

i am not sold on the madame x being melia theory

why didnt she just overlap melia?

now, some people would say that she hadnt unlocked her powers 

but why didnt she overlap melia in bad future?

[earthprisonpanopticon]

15 hours ago, 0 SPD Slowpoke said:

Remember that according to the hospital reports, Anathea (Maria's mother) is stated to have black hair. Madame X is 100% a Melia of some kind, or I'm tattooing Melia's face on my asscheeks.

 

37 minutes ago, CrystalStar said:

now, some people would say that she hadnt unlocked her powers 

but why didnt she overlap melia in bad future?

wouldn't it make more sense for Madame X to be Anathea in that case? (or even Marianette instead if you buy into the idea that Melia and Maria/Marianette aren't the same person)

the whole black hair thing + the fact that she didn't (couldn't?) overlap Melia. there was also that whole thing in the prologue where M. X told Maria not to give up, which connects the two on some level as well

[CrystalStar]

i dont think madame x has any connection to melia or marianette or anathea

 

[O0mega]

I think theres two possible reasons Madame X hasn't overlapped Melia if she is connected.

1. I haven't done it myself but I believe if you beat Madame X at Blacksteeple Castle she says something along the lines of "I've failed you father" (Please corredt me if im wrong, again only heard about it never done it.) Which implies that Madame X isnt the one in charge, or at least shes acting on someone else will. Possible Vitus/Indriad. Whoever it is could have told Madame X not to overlap.

2. Madame X doesn't seem like a cardboard cutout evil villain. You can see this with the pity she shows in the prologue of the game.

Now neither of these are a catch all reason but it at least is a start. Also the the medical file does lend itself slightly to Madame X being related to Melia and her family.

[R.A.M CXZ 007]

7 hours ago, O0mega said:

Now neither of these are a catch all reason but it at least is a start. Also the the medical file does lend itself slightly to Madame X being related to Melia and her family.

this is possibility 

[TheHellHamster]

Another possibility could be that Madame X just doesn't want to take the risk that they might lose against Melia.

[Feng Lei]

My only comment is that maybe the Suit is what prevents Madame X from overlapping with Melia/Maria. You will notice also that we have a very strange connexion to her helmet. The armor is where we reappear right before the game over in the bad ending for the ruined future... so SOMETHING happened to Madame X. But there's no body. It makes little sense for Melanie to have left the armor there, as well, it is just strange, but not overtly so.

 

She also makes a comment at one point, though the dialogue changes due to reasons I don't know, about "If it wasn't for this blasted suit/armor!".

 

The armor is also a big point in Amethyst cave... and it gets immediately possessed by people who are supposedly dead. And it is produced by what at least appears to be a time-shift stone.

 

It would not surprise me if the suit is basically keeping whoever or whatever Madame X invulnerable or at least resistant to time deletion. But that's all conjecture. Just pointing out that her suit is important and it's got some kind of time-based purpose involved with it that has been demonstrated but not explained.

[R.A.M CXZ 007]

ok that an interesting idea suit and why does her yvetal has soulstone is she going to collect the souls for something

[TeneSicarius]

Something I realized when replaying the game was the encounter with the Rift Gardevoir: When Vitus takes back "his power" from Gardevoir, it loses it's shiny form. 

 

And in the doomed timeline, Kenneth said that there'd been no new shiny pokemon since the doomsday event

 

Shiny Pokemon might be plot-relevant a few chapters from now; I've been paying more attention to which pokemon on each team is shiny, and which gym leaders carry shiny pokemon. 

[CrystalStar]

3 hours ago, TeneSicarius said:

Something I realized when replaying the game was the encounter with the Rift Gardevoir: When Vitus takes back "his power" from Gardevoir, it loses it's shiny form. 

 

And in the doomed timeline, Kenneth said that there'd been no new shiny pokemon since the doomsday event

 

Shiny Pokemon might be plot-relevant a few chapters from now; I've been paying more attention to which pokemon on each team is shiny, and which gym leaders carry shiny pokemon. 

you might be on to someting here...

 

[Shiruu34]

On 6/7/2021 at 6:14 AM, TeneSicarius said:

Something I realized when replaying the game was the encounter with the Rift Gardevoir: When Vitus takes back "his power" from Gardevoir, it loses it's shiny form. 

 

And in the doomed timeline, Kenneth said that there'd been no new shiny pokemon since the doomsday event

 

Shiny Pokemon might be plot-relevant a few chapters from now; I've been paying more attention to which pokemon on each team is shiny, and which gym leaders carry shiny pokemon. 

The gym leaders / characters that have shiny pokémon are these I think: Melia who always has a full team of shinies, Keta has a Shiny Lucario and Shiny Ninetales as a ghost, Erick has a Shiny Electivire, Flora has a Shiny Venusaur, Florin has a Shiny Sceptile ( he also has a Shiny Tangrowth and Cradilly in Intense mode only ), Adam has a Shiny Sudowoodo and Probopass in Casual, a Shiny Aurorus and Kabutops in Normal and a Shiny Archeops and Terrakion in Intense, Ryland has a Shiny Claydol, Damien has a Shiny Latios, Zetta / Ren have a Shiny Silvally, Karrina has a Shiny Alakazam, Crescent has a Shiny Gothitelle and Erin has a Shiny Florgess. Some of these might indeed be plot-relevant but many don't really seem like they are.

[TeneSicarius]

On 6/8/2021 at 8:13 AM, Shiruu34 said:

The gym leaders / characters that have shiny pokémon are these I think: Melia who always has a full team of shinies, Keta has a Shiny Lucario and Shiny Ninetales as a ghost, Erick has a Shiny Electivire, Flora has a Shiny Venusaur, Florin has a Shiny Sceptile ( he also has a Shiny Tangrowth and Cradilly in Intense mode only ), Adam has a Shiny Sudowoodo and Probopass in Casual, a Shiny Aurorus and Kabutops in Normal and a Shiny Archeops and Terrakion in Intense, Ryland has a Shiny Claydol, Damien has a Shiny Latios, Zetta / Ren have a Shiny Silvally, Karrina has a Shiny Alakazam, Crescent has a Shiny Gothitelle and Erin has a Shiny Florgess. Some of these might indeed be plot-relevant but many don't really seem like they are.

 

I was thinking that, Adam had more than one shiny in all versions, and 4 shinies in Intense when his team changes to Normal when you control him, which is very unusual. If his team got changed around due to Kieran, and if next chapter we can battle Valarie and she also has a changed team with new shiny pokemon, that might point to then also having some of the same powers as Vitus. 

[Shiruu34]

3 hours ago, TeneSicarius said:

 

I was thinking that, Adam had more than one shiny in all versions, and 4 shinies in Intense when his team changes to Normal when you control him, which is very unusual. If his team got changed around due to Kieran, and if next chapter we can battle Valarie and she also has a changed team with new shiny pokemon, that might point to then also having some of the same powers as Vitus. 

Well both Adam and Ryland are ancestors of king Ieisel, I don't think Valarie has any connection to those old times, then again I also don't understand why Florin out of all gym leaders is one that has 3 shinies on his Intense team.

[TeneSicarius]

No I said them getting shinies after Kieran messes with their mind; I never mentioned ryland or ancient times or Leisel or anything even close to that.

 

One shiny in your life isn't weird in-universe, Melia's full shiny team is just shy of being outright stated to be as a result of Arceus's Light, and unobtainable for any normal person (Our character's shiny rate might also be highly unusual), and Adam is only non-generic NPC aside from Melia to have more than one shiny across all difficulties (Where Love Lies shows that Keta's Ninetails was a gift from Tesla, and I think his Lucario might've been something from his father; talking with it requires a close bond, and he didn't develop that until Chapter 3 in that game, yet it was evolved at Chapter 1). Young and new trainers basically never have a shiny pokemon (Ren, Venam, Aelita, Amber), the weaker gym leaders (1-8) have no shinies (except Keta but unlike the rest he's not a new gym leader), while every gym leader that isn't a replacement has a shiny. Florin's weird because it's only on one version, and that version isn't the default one, and the Intense Major Battles doesn't say that any pokemon are supposed to be shiny aside from Sceptile. Kieran not having shinies might imply a different reason for Adam having 2, and also imply that Kieran doesn't have any Light of Arceus. 

 

Shinies are usually someone's ace (aka naturally stronger than the rest of their team), the dialogue with Vitus implied that being shiny is a result of having Arceus's Light. Plus from Rift Aelita we know that rifts are based on inner power that pokemon naturally have more of (and her rift is a Regirock, and Vivian had the power to create / summon Regirock on the spot), and we know of two rifts being made from shiny pokemon (gardevoir and garbodor), but it's hard to tell if they're canonically stronger than normal rifts or if the other rifts are weak cuz they're early game. Vivian having none, and Aelita not having any shinies on either of her two teams might imply that whatever Vivian had about listening to the world has nothing to do with Arceus (or gaining shinies after awaking the power confirming it). 

 

The 3rd thing is that shinies might've only started appearing after Storm 7; while the game doesn't change your shiny odds in the past (and Melia can find shinies in the destroyed world), no one in the past had any shinies on their teams; the Regis might be shiny cuz I remember Angie piercing herself with a red crystal to summon Regice and shiny Regice is blood red, and Vivian never battled with Regirock, and the golems are called "gifts from Arceus". Gardevoir's "Past Reflections" showed her as a shiny ralts, but Vitus messed with her mind a bunch that it could go either way. We'd need Mr. Luck to talk about his ralts to know if it was actually shiny, but if it was, and that Vitus talked about it's true power in that scene because it was shiny, and him "taking back his power", I kinda think he's the first human that despises pokemon for having more of Arceus's power, since the Narcissa sidequest shows that he never ages and takes on new identities all the time. 

 

 

 

 

It's hard to actually gain any useful information from any of this; at best it'll just help point to important things in the future. 

 

Edit: Thinking about it more, for normal people, it's probably more likely that experienced trainers have a shiny, and people who've explored a bunch have a shiny. The Puppetmasters and Souta have essentially been raised in captivity, no shiny. Ryland is experienced but never left the badlands, 1 shiny. Adam is experienced and spent most of his life exploring, 2 shinies. Ren / Aelita are new trainers only just starting to explore, Venam / Saki / Amber / Crawli / Valarie are young / new leaders that mostly stick to their own towns, no shiny. 

Edited June 9, 2021 by TeneSicarius

[R.A.M CXZ 007]

may be there might be some truth there

 

[Feng Lei]

On 2/22/2021 at 2:21 PM, enderowl said:

I remember noticing some details about the Mansion in Chapter 3, mostly around the area where we face off against Maria.  The placed almost had the same layout as the Pyramid and it was behind the Chrysalis Mansion. 

Oooh! I just found this post!

 

M...maybe Indriad... Maybe the reason.

 

Oh. Oh Arceus I think you've solved it enderowl.

 

Indriad is going to DESTROY THE WORLD.

 

And then leave. With Maria.

 

And remember what she says? "Something, a force, always held me back," or something. Maybe she instinctively realized or the pyramid stops people from leaving that area... because there's nowhere else to go in the simulated environment. And Indriad would have surely precautions to stop people form wandering into the ship's control rooms.

 

So the Chyrsalis is called such because Indriad plans, in all liklihood, to spend his time breaking Marionette to his will, and then possibly the Archetype itself, and then maybe use it to create a new earth in his own image, while he reigns from heaven above in the pyramid!!