Duo-weather team

[Promethe]

This whole premise began because I wanted to build a quaint competitive team for a reborn playthrough. There's this saying in french, "Après la pluie, le beau temps" or "After the rain, [comes] nice weather", and I wanted to make a team around that. There's a lot to fix, I feel like EV repartission and some teammates could use some work for starters. 

 

Politoed

Spoiler

Politoed @ Damp Rock
Ability: Drizzle
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 Spe
Bold Nature
- Scald
- Perish Song
- Toxic
- Protect

The most dreadful creature in existance. His name is Glenn for people who're curious.

 

Mantine

Spoiler

Mantine @ Leftovers
Ability: Swift Swim
EVs: 64 HP / 252 Spa / 192 Spe
Modest/Calm Nature
- Hydropump
- Hurricane 
- Ice Beam
- Tailwind

One of the MVPs, way too biased on that one. Named him Waver because I'm watching too much FATE lately.

 

Magnezone

Spoiler

Magnezone @ Quickclaw
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 56 HP / 252 Spa / 200 Spe
Timid Nature
- Sunny Day
- Thunder
- Volt Switch
- Zap Cannon

"Aha, thunder go Bippity boppity BOO-M."

 

Steelix

Spoiler

Steelix @ Steelixite
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 212 HP / 252 Atk / 44 Spd
Adamant Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Earthquake
- Steel Roller
- Rock Slide

Just meant to be his annoying chonky self. Steel Roller effectively ends the weather cycle and hurts like a truck. 

 

Infernape

Spoiler

Infernape @ Black Belt
Ability: Iron Fist
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Naive/Jolly Nature
- Fire Punch
- U-Turn
- Mach Punch
- Sword Dance

Gets a boost from Mags' Sunny Day. Usually sent first or last. Trying to play with his moveset, it works but its a bit bland.

 

Wigglypuff

Spoiler

Wigglypuff @ Life Orb
Ability: Competitive
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Spa / 4 Spe
Modest Nature
- Dazzling Gleam
- Hyper Beam 
- Heal Bell
- Copycat

The empty slot, so to speak. Not the best, but he covers a lot of weak points. Must susceptible to change. 

[Edo]

In Reborn you won't be able to get most of the TM moves you planned on, like Earthquake, Thunder, Volt Switch, U-Turn, Swords Dance or Ice Beam (unless you use Debug/Sandbox to cheat them in).

Also Steel Roller and Hurricane on Mantine are only in Gen 8, so you can't get those either since Reborn is Gen 7 (and Gen8 won't get added).

 

I really like that team tho. Infernape is really good, and Mantine and Steelix are a great combo since they cover each other's weaknesses very well.

 

And as someone who also played through Reborn with a Rainbow team using Rain and Sun, I'd like to give some suggestions if you don't mind.

 

First of all, I suggest changing Magnezone's moveset, because it doesn't really profit from Sunny Day, especially as a Steel type.  (And Thunder actually loses accuracy during sun, so that would be a bad combination if you had it)

Magnezone has some other great moves which take advantage of the Rainbow field though, like Sonic Boom and Tri Attack, which both get some insane damage boosts.

 

Some other mon which can take the role of sunsetter could be for example Wigglytuff. It learns both Sunny Day and Flamethrower. Or Infernape since it's already Fire.

But personally I prefer having a Drought user and a Drizzle user on the team instead of using the moves Sunny Day/Rain Dance, because it can help enormously to set weather on the switch-in, instead of having to wait one turn to use the move. But surely not necessary if you don't like Ninetales or Torkoal.

 

For Infernape, since the Swords Dance TM doesn't exist yet, it would be interesting to use a special or mixed set, with Nasty Plot/Work Up and Fire Pledge (Fire Pledge gets boosted by 1.5x on Rainbow field, additionally to the sun boost, so it's Infernape's best Fire move when Rainbow field is active).  Would be nice if Vacuum Wave was possible to get for a special set

[Promethe]

9 minutes ago, Edo said:

And as someone who also played through Reborn with a Rainbow team using Rain and Sun, I'd like to give some suggestions if you don't mind.

So it's called a rainbow team? Noice. And thanks for the feedback, it's cool. (If I didn't want to know what other people think, I might as well not post.)

Quote

I really like that team tho. Infernape is really good, and Mantine and Steelix are a great combo since they cover each other's weaknesses very well.

 

[Happy newb noises] 

 

For Magnezone I knew the setup wouldn't work, and I'm thinking of adding Torkoal like you said, I really like the lil guy. I kinda want to keep Magnezone though, he can really help in a pinch... Also I'm really liking Sonic boom thanks for that.

 

I could set up Wiggly to praise the sun really hard, but its not the most efficient. The reason why I added Wiggly was that, out of memory, I'm leaving myself open to psychic/fairy/dragon if Infernape or Mantine faints. Wiggly's supposed to be a backup support for that, but its not too crucial.

29 minutes ago, Edo said:

For Infernape, since the Swords Dance TM doesn't exist yet, it would be interesting to use a special or mixed set, with Nasty Plot/Work Up and Fire Pledge (Fire Pledge gets boosted by 1.5x on Rainbow field, additionally to the sun boost, so it's Infernape's best Fire move when Rainbow field is active).  Would be nice if Vacuum Wave was possible to get for a special set

I did think Infernape was a good mixed attacker. Depending on the foe it might even deal mor damage. Goes to show that min-maxing isn't always the best. Thanks for another great suggestion. Should I keep Iron Fist? Don't think so, especially since Sun Wukong over there isn't necessarily to tanky.

 

Also U-Turn's and Sword Dance aren't available in-game? (My disappointment is immesurable and my day is ruined) Not gonna cheat for that, so I'll work with. 

[Rendolf]

Some tips for each of your members.

 

Politoed: Seems pretty good, although having both Toxic and Perish Song feels redundant. You also might want to train Special Defense rather than Defense, but that's up to you.

 

Mantine: As was said above, Mantine doesn't get Hurricane in Gen 7 and Ice Beam as a TM is not yet available in Reborn, so you'll need to swap out those moves. One thing I definitely recommend you have on it is Roost. Mantine got Roost in Gen 7 and it was a godsend for it, pretty much if you're running Mantine you're running Roost too. Also you get Leftovers pretty late so you need a placeholder item until then (remember to not sell your Balm Mushroom).

 

Magnezone: Again as said above the TMs for Volt Switch and Thunder aren't available yet. Unfortunately that means that you won't be able to utilize the rain for your Magnezone much. Additionally you don't get access to Magnemite/Magneton until fairly late in the game and you aren't able to evolve to Magnezone until even later. If those don't discourage you, then I would recommend against using Zap Cannon since it's super unreliable (you might have meant to say Flash Cannon which is a good choice) and Sunny Day is not great on Magnezone since you'll take even more Fire damage. For replacements I would definitely say use Flash Cannon as it's a really solid special Steel STAB and probably Discharge (maybe replace with Thunderbolt when you get the TM, but that's super late. actually looking at the Rainbow Field effects probably keep Discharge since that would be a 60% chance to paralyze). The other two moves could be pretty much anything you want, if you're running sun on something else then Rainbow Field moves could be useful as was recommended.

 

Steelix: Steel Roller doesn't exist in Gen 7 and you can't get the TM for Earthquake yet. For a Steel move you'll probably want Gyro Ball since Steelix is pretty dang slow. Nothing in the game is really a good replacement for Earthquake, but the best you can do is probably Stomping Tantrum, and maybe have Dig/Bulldoze or an elemental fang move until you get the tutor.

 

Infernape: U-Turn and Swords Dance unavailable. If you still want to do physical be aware that the tutor for Fire Punch isn't available until pretty late, so you'll need alternate Fire STAB until then (Flare Blitz is powerful, but it's learned at a high level, though you'll definitely be there before Fire Punch). I'd definitely recommend Close Combat since it's super strong and Mach Punch isn't really enough Fighting coverage. Keep Mach Punch though, and for your last move I would say either Thunder Punch or Bulk Up, both available at/after you can get Fire Punch, or you could use it as your sun setter. (Special is an option too: Nasty Plot, Fire Pledge/Flamethrower, Focus Blast, Solar Beam or something)

 

Wigglytuff: It's alright. Dazzling Gleam, Hyper Beam, and Heal Bell are all unavailable until pretty late and Copycat is only learnable by Igglybuff at level 11. I would recommend Hyper Voice over Hyper Beam since it's still pretty strong but doesn't require recharge plus it goes through Substitutes, and it's available slightly before you get Hyper Beam. You could run Sunny Day and Flamethrower as was suggested, but even so Wigglytuff isn't amazing and you might be better off swapping it for something with Drought (Torkoal isn't available until pretty late, so you might be better off with Ninetales. You have a 1/18 chance to get a Kantonian Vulpix before the 3rd gym, otherwise you can get it a while later; just be sure to catch a Stunfisk when you get to Apophyll Beach. Also remember to wait until level 42 to evolve it if you want Fire Blast, since the only good attack that Ninetales learns by level up is Flamethrower).

 

The reason why this would be called a Rainbow team is that in Reborn if you set up Rain and Sun at the same time it will change the field into a Rainbow Field which has all kinds of cool effects, all of which are listed here: https://pokemon-reborn.fandom.com/wiki/Rainbow_Field

 

But that's pretty much it. Sorry it was a bit long, I went into progressively more detail as I went along. Anyway have fun!

Edited October 16, 2020 by Rendolf

[Promethe]

7 hours ago, Rendolf said:

Sorry it was a bit long, I went into progressively more detail as I went along. Anyway have fun!

I plan on having fun tinkering with team setups, that's for sure. That's really a comprehensive overview, thanks for taking some of your time: all those are neat things to know. I'm curious though, why Stunfisk?

[Rendolf]

36 minutes ago, Promethe said:

I'm curious though, why Stunfisk?

You get Kantonian Vulpix from a trade for a Stunfisk and you can't go catch one once you gain access to the trade.

[SJMistery]

It's hard to rate this team, but I can already say that manual weather is extremely unreliable. You want to use Mega Steelix for some reason, so you will have to go with Torkoal or Ninetales if you want sun. But I'd recommend you to simply make a hybrid rain team capable of working well outside of rain (granted that's how about 95% of the modern rain teams work anyway, so it's not very original), since "no weather conditions" is already "clear skies".

 

And speaking of Steelix, both him, and pretty much everybody else is really not worth using at all. The frist two are completely outclassed by Aggron and Pelliper respectively, and I'd argue if you aren't using something like Kingdra, Greninja or Mega Swampert, it's not worth really using Pelliper either. I'd recommend bringing at least Swampert on the place of Steelix, since they both offer similar defensive utility but Swampert comes with excellent damage output in and out of rain.

 

Infernape CAN work in modern times as a sucide Stealth Rock lead, but he doesn't offer anything else, especially considering here in Reborn we allow Blaziken to be used freely.

 

As for Wigglytuff, Clefable is a much better option to use overall.

 

Finnally, Mantine as mentioned above does not have Hurricane and even if it had, it's special attack is too low to work with. Mantine has some niche use as a Haze-spamming specially defensive wall, but nothing else. Volcarona and Dragonite are much better users of Hurricane, especially the former if you want a dual sun-rain team.

 

I know despite wanting it to be somewhat competitive, it's mostly for an in-game run, but even then I'd recommend using some better pokemon. However, let's assume you ignore all of this above and you insist on using the 6 mentioned pokemon and nobody else:

 

For starters, the ONLY thing Politoed has over Pelliper is Perish Song and Encore. Use the latter instead of Protect, the last thing you want is waste rain turns with it.

 

Mantine as mentioned must be reworked as an utility pokemon. The problem is it will then be completely redundant to Politoed, so again I ask you to seriously reconsider him. Only Hurricane+Swift Swim pokemon available in Gen 7 is Swanna, wich is just about as bad. Again, I recommend running Volcarona instead, but you CAN use a Haze+Defog+Scald+Roost set with Water Absorb that will at least provide some good utility.

 

Now on Magnezone, the FIRST thing you ABSOLUTELY MUST do is remove that Quick Claw IMMEDIATELY. If you want speed on him use a Choice Scarf instead. And of course replace Sunny day and Zap Cannon with Flash Cannon and Hidden Power Ice or Fire.

 

Next Infernape, as said his only thing is Focus Sash+Fake Out/Endeavour+Stealth Rock+Fire Blast+Close Combat/Mach Punch. Maybe give him Sunny day over Stealth Rock if you REALLY want to keep the dual weather thing, even if it won't be useful for anyone.

 

Steelix, run a Curse set with Rest, Earthquake and Stone Edge. Not good, but the best this thing can do, I'm working with small pickings here.

 

Wigglytuff, swap him with someone capable of using sun in some capacity, for example Venusaur, or alternatively put Volcarona in this place, you got Defog on Mantine to support him, and he can run a Quiver Dance+Hurricane+Feiry Dance/Hidden Power Ground+Giga Drain set that can have good utility as a late game cleaner.

 

 

On 10/16/2020 at 5:27 PM, Edo said:

Reborn is Gen 7 (and Gen8 won't get added).

I restored my faith in humanity.


PD remind me to update my signature, this team I have down there is long obsolete.