Very harsh critique for Intense mode (13.02, Set/No Items) [Spoilers]

[AceTrainerDevin]

4 minutes ago, Cyphre said:

That doesnt seem like you took x5 30% attack boosts into consideration here, as well as 1.5 boost from Haunted Field. I doubt you can calculate this with calculators that exist for base pokemon games, so this one is void and null anyway. Would appreciate if you applied this to the damage formula directly, although it is hard to say if this 30% boost applies to base attack every time or percentages go up for every death. 
 

Actually i did take into account the field boost ai damage boost and the crest boost why else would the spiritomb in the calc have huge power plus 1 attack and a muscle band

[AceTrainerDevin]

19 minutes ago, Cyphre said:

And how many people, in your opinion, would fully invest in Defence on Delphox naturally? Because even with a berry this is hardly an uninvested Defence stat. 

Since damage rolls dont exist on intense you just need a kasib berry to survive spiritomb with delphox
+1 Lvl 87 252+ Atk Muscle Band Huge Power Spiritomb Shadow Sneak vs. Lvl 85 0 HP / 0 Def Kasib Berry Delphox: 215-253 (86.6 - 102%) -- 12.5% chance to OHKO

Edited August 5, 2021 by AceTrainerDevin

[Cyphre]

Just now, AceTrainerDevin said:

Actually i did take into account the field boost ai damage boost and the crest boost why else would the spiritomb in the calc have huge power plus 1 attack and a muscle band

I want to try to apply it directly to the damage formula. Level 87 Spiritomb with 252 Atk EV got 270 Atk, while Mega Altaria with 252 Defence EV got 271 Defence, so basic damage should be around 47, 46.98 from my calculcaitons. WIth added 30% x5 increase (assuming it's flat from base attack every time, which might not be the case at all), Shadow Sneak on 31 Iv 252 Def EV should deal 175 damage, that is true. 

Now if your Mega Altaria is not invested in Defence, basic damage becomes 57, and with boosts + field it becomes 213 damage. We are talking here about 31 Hp and Def IV, however without EV training. Such Mega Altaria has 248 HP. 

While it doesnt outright one shot, the picture changes entirely if some of it's IVs are not perfect. And that, again, assuming we add same 30% bonus of its basic attack to calculations every time, and it doesnt scale with every consequtive boost. Which can be tested, but i do not have backup saves this far back, so only developers can tell which one is the case here. As well is Mega Altaria having very respectable bulk with 75 base HP and 110 base Defence. 

While it might be a given for a lot of players that they should breed perfect IVs, far from most players will pour so many hours into such things, especially considering a lot of pokemon will have to be changed for a lot of fights, with berries or without. 

I understand what you are trying to say, but we are, again, talking about just several selected direct counters, and even then they need to be very well attuned. Not to mention it's just Shadow Sneak with pathetic 40 base power, anything that will not one shot Spiritomb will be a subject to a much more deadly Phantom Force or 100% Hypnosis. I do not deny it is possible and there are ways to do it reliably, my main argument is still that it bottlenecks you into naturally preferring several types and strategies, while completely closing off a lot of others. 



 

[321_King_123]

17 hours ago, robinho said:

 

I feel like despite raging against every boss battle because of stuff like infinite PP (It's not on every boss I just stalled Kyogre out with regen tangrowth and shedinja) lvl cap cheese and the pokemon with 756 EVs,

 

Wait.. What?? Which Pokemon´s have 756 EV´s?? I didnt even knew they made boss Pokemon´s that strong!

 

 

 

 

[AceTrainerDevin]

34 minutes ago, Cyphre said:

While it doesnt outright one shot, the picture changes entirely if some of it's IVs are not perfect.

not really since it still lives with 0 ivs and 0 evs and can almost kill with no attack ivs
+1 Lvl 87 252+ Atk Muscle Band Huge Power Spiritomb Shadow Sneak vs. Lvl 85 0 HP / 0 Def Altaria-Mega: 171-202 (77 - 90.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Lvl 85 252+ Atk Pixilate Altaria-Mega Return vs. Lvl 87 252 HP / 252 Def Spiritomb: 222-264 (83.7 - 99.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
so if you have another mon in the back that can tank a hit you should be fine even without that good ivs

 

34 minutes ago, Cyphre said:

I understand what you are trying to say, but we are, again, talking about just several selected direct counters, and even then they need to be very well attuned

i feel like you are heavily underestimating how many pokemon can take down that spiritomb while yes spiritomb is threatening it isnt just an instant win button and all you really need to take it on is a pokemon that can take a shadow sneak and can deal considerable damage back you only need to worry about phantom force if you are slower and if hypnosis is a problem run a chesto berry

Edited August 5, 2021 by AceTrainerDevin

[AceTrainerDevin]

2 hours ago, AceTrainerDevin said:

Edit: did a calc Spiritomb doesnt even kill 0 bulk investment mega altaria with shadow sneak while altaria just one hits it with Return or Hyper voice +1 Lvl 87 252+ Atk Muscle Band Huge Power Spiritomb Shadow Sneak vs. Lvl 85 0 HP / 0 Def Altaria-Mega: 151-178 (60.8 - 71.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Lvl 85 252 Atk Pixilate Altaria-Mega Return vs. Lvl 87 252 HP / 252 Def Spiritomb: 444-528 (167.5 - 199.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO

Lvl 85 252 SpA Pixilate Altaria-Mega Hyper Voice vs. Lvl 87 252 HP / 252 SpD Spiritomb: 396-468 (149.4 - 176.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO

also i just realized i forgot to remove spiritombs dual dark typing from these calcs after i did the spirit break calcs since spirit break is 4x effective against spiritomb on haunted field although the correct ones arent too different besides the hyper voice one as that is the only one that no longer kills
+1 Lvl 87 252+ Atk Muscle Band Huge Power Spiritomb Shadow Sneak vs. Lvl 85 0 HP / 0 Def Altaria-Mega: 151-178 (60.8 - 71.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Lvl 85 252+ SpA Pixilate Altaria-Mega Hyper Voice vs. Lvl 87 252 HP / 252 SpD Spiritomb: 218-258 (82.2 - 97.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Lvl 85 252+ Atk Pixilate Altaria-Mega Return vs. Lvl 87 252 HP / 252 Def Spiritomb: 246-290 (92.8 - 109.4%) -- 56.3% chance to OHKO

Edited August 5, 2021 by AceTrainerDevin

[Mionee]

I personally haven't noticed v13 being more or less difficult than the previous versions of the game. I did, however, notice a lot of friends who were overly relying on items and switch mode having a harsh wake-up call since v13 doesn't let them use that anymore. Out of curiosity, did you use items before?

 

While Melia and Geara are definitely stacked fights they're far from unbeatable even with trash tier mons, Here they are getting beaten by LC mons, without even a full team in Geara's case: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LxjbnWrNG10&list=PLvLVu3yu-0q0uewKyvHn0VRT6V86jZ7s7&index=10 / https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3eSkOE1dd0g

 

I do however agree that the fields ought to be more dynamic, as I too absolutely hate when a field cannot be changed at all. That said, note that even in those cases you can *always* summon certain fields with pledges, weathers, etc. However I don't have an issue with leaders having countermeasures to field changes. Of course they want to preserve their advantage, so I think it's good that Amber continually tries to revert the mountain back to her volcano top. It would be very boring if you could just put every fight into a garbage field without them being able to do anything about it,.

 

Regardless, the difficulty is imo just right. Personally, I'd even welcome even harder fights if anything. There's Normal and Casual for a reason, and honestly, there's nothing wrong with playing those difficulty modes! I don't recommend any of my friends to play intense unless they're really feeling masochistic and that's the way it should be, imo.

 

[Horyzon]

It's also really annoying to me that the trainer don't abide to standard rules anymore. Saki with 2 Mega Evolutions and ON TOP of that her M-Aggron was even holding a seed. Then the maxed out EVs in every single stat makes absolutely no sense at all. I tried to beat Geara's Spiritomb with my Spiritomb, expecting mine to outspeed with 252 Speed EVs and Jolly nature, but nope his was still faster wtf. Fights feel more like memorizing what the opponent will use and based on that experience predict and counter the move and keep restarting until I've scripted the whole fight.

[321_King_123]

5 minutes ago, Horyzon said:

It's also really annoying to me that the trainer don't abide to standard rules anymore. Saki with 2 Mega Evolutions and ON TOP of that her M-Aggron was even holding a seed. Then the maxed out EVs in every single stat makes absolutely no sense at all. I tried to beat Geara's Spiritomb with my Spiritomb, expecting mine to outspeed with 252 Speed EVs and Jolly nature, but nope his was still faster wtf. Fights feel more like memorizing what the opponent will use and based on that experience predict and counter the move and keep restarting until I've scripted the whole fight.

 

Geara´s Spiritomb only out-speeded yours, because of the Spiritomb Crest

[321_King_123]

8 minutes ago, Mionee said:

I personally haven't noticed v13 being more or less difficult than the previous versions of the game. I did, however, notice a lot of friends who were overly relying on items and switch mode having a harsh wake-up call since v13 doesn't let them use that anymore. Out of curiosity, did you use items before?

 

 

 

Tried not using any items... In reborn i only used like 3 times. But, in rejuv, i just gave up and started using items. I want a enjoyfull experience, not a experience that will make my head explode

[AceTrainerDevin]

1 minute ago, Horyzon said:

 I tried to beat Geara's Spiritomb with my Spiritomb, expecting mine to outspeed with 252 Speed EVs and Jolly nature, but nope his was still faster wtf

ok so either you have 19 or less speed ivs in which case youd get speed tied for 19 ivs and outsped for any less or gearas spiritomb used shadow sneak and you didnt use a prio move against it

[AceTrainerDevin]

2 minutes ago, 321_King_123 said:

 

Geara´s Spiritomb only out-speeded yours, because of the Spiritomb Crest

that crest doesnt boost speed

[321_King_123]

1 minute ago, AceTrainerDevin said:

that crest doesnt boost speed

Doesnt? I though it made every Spiritomb status +30% for each Pokemon of their own team defeated... Does it only applies for offensive status?

[AceTrainerDevin]

1 minute ago, 321_King_123 said:

Doesnt? I though it made every Spiritomb status +30% for each Pokemon of their own team defeated... Does it only applies for offensive status?

yeah its just the attacking stats which has been nerfed to just a 20% for every fainted ally in v13

[Horyzon]

Afaik the crest only boosts its attack. And yeah my Spiritomb didn't have the best of speed IVs, but I definitely didn't expect his Spiritomb to have fully invested speed EVs with how strong and bulky it was, until I realized that it has 252 EVs in every stat. 

[Azeria]

23 minutes ago, Mionee said:

I personally haven't noticed v13 being more or less difficult than the previous versions of the game. I did, however, notice a lot of friends who were overly relying on items and switch mode having a harsh wake-up call since v13 doesn't let them use that anymore. Out of curiosity, did you use items before?

 

While Melia and Geara are definitely stacked fights they're far from unbeatable even with trash tier mons, Here they are getting beaten by LC mons, without even a full team in Geara's case: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LxjbnWrNG10&list=PLvLVu3yu-0q0uewKyvHn0VRT6V86jZ7s7&index=10 / https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3eSkOE1dd0g

 

I do however agree that the fields ought to be more dynamic, as I too absolutely hate when a field cannot be changed at all. That said, note that even in those cases you can *always* summon certain fields with pledges, weathers, etc. However I don't have an issue with leaders having countermeasures to field changes. Of course they want to preserve their advantage, so I think it's good that Amber continually tries to revert the mountain back to her volcano top. It would be very boring if you could just put every fight into a garbage field without them being able to do anything about it,.

 

Regardless, the difficulty is imo just right. Personally, I'd even welcome even harder fights if anything. There's Normal and Casual for a reason, and honestly, there's nothing wrong with playing those difficulty modes! I don't recommend any of my friends to play intense unless they're really feeling masochistic and that's the way it should be, imo.

 

I would like to point out that the no items/set mode thing is specifically a choice at the start of a new run or booting up an old intense mode run up in v13. I do believe that if they just mashed through that, they may have made a choice they would come to regret.

 

21 minutes ago, Horyzon said:

It's also really annoying to me that the trainer don't abide to standard rules anymore. Saki with 2 Mega Evolutions and ON TOP of that her M-Aggron was even holding a seed. Then the maxed out EVs in every single stat makes absolutely no sense at all. I tried to beat Geara's Spiritomb with my Spiritomb, expecting mine to outspeed with 252 Speed EVs and Jolly nature, but nope his was still faster wtf. Fights feel more like memorizing what the opponent will use and based on that experience predict and counter the move and keep restarting until I've scripted the whole fight.

His Spiritomb is level 87 with Adamant Nature 31 Ivs 252 speed evs. for Jolly Spiritomb to be slower it would need 22 speed IVs or less, and maxing out IVs is now easily doable with the IV doctor in GDC's Pokemon Hospital. I implore you to use it as you need, especially in the upcoming patch  where the prices have gotten massively slashed.

 

1 hour ago, Cyphre said:

I want to try to apply it directly to the damage formula. Level 87 Spiritomb with 252 Atk EV got 270 Atk, while Mega Altaria with 252 Defence EV got 271 Defence, so basic damage should be around 47, 46.98 from my calculcaitons. WIth added 30% x5 increase (assuming it's flat from base attack every time, which might not be the case at all), Shadow Sneak on 31 Iv 252 Def EV should deal 175 damage, that is true. 

Now if your Mega Altaria is not invested in Defence, basic damage becomes 57, and with boosts + field it becomes 213 damage. We are talking here about 31 Hp and Def IV, however without EV training. Such Mega Altaria has 248 HP. 

While it doesnt outright one shot, the picture changes entirely if some of it's IVs are not perfect. And that, again, assuming we add same 30% bonus of its basic attack to calculations every time, and it doesnt scale with every consequtive boost. Which can be tested, but i do not have backup saves this far back, so only developers can tell which one is the case here. As well is Mega Altaria having very respectable bulk with 75 base HP and 110 base Defence. 

While it might be a given for a lot of players that they should breed perfect IVs, far from most players will pour so many hours into such things, especially considering a lot of pokemon will have to be changed for a lot of fights, with berries or without. 

I understand what you are trying to say, but we are, again, talking about just several selected direct counters, and even then they need to be very well attuned. Not to mention it's just Shadow Sneak with pathetic 40 base power, anything that will not one shot Spiritomb will be a subject to a much more deadly Phantom Force or 100% Hypnosis. I do not deny it is possible and there are ways to do it reliably, my main argument is still that it bottlenecks you into naturally preferring several types and strategies, while completely closing off a lot of others. 



 

Developer here, Spiritomb crest works off the raw attack and simply adds (20% x Number of fainted Pokemon on its side). 

[321_King_123]

5 minutes ago, AceTrainerDevin said:

yeah its just the attacking stats which has been nerfed to just a 20% for every fainted ally in v13

I see! Thank you ^^

[Cyphre]

56 minutes ago, AceTrainerDevin said:

i feel like you are heavily underestimating how many pokemon can take down that spiritomb while yes spiritomb is threatening it isnt just an instant win button

If he was even worse and unbeatable i would have a rage rant, not a critique. You also heavily overestimate, first, amount of players who will be prepared for such a threat immediately, as well as amount of pokemon who are capable of one shotting spiritomb in this situation while surviving Shadow Sneak from hell. Again, im not advocating for a Crest nerf, im advocating for an opportunity for me to counter the entire field and use a different approach.

 

 

5 minutes ago, Azeria said:

Developer here, Spiritomb crest works of the raw attack and simply adds (20% x Number of fainted Pokemon on its side). 

Edit: Nvm, read message above. 

[321_King_123]

12 minutes ago, Azeria said:

I and maxing out IVs is now easily doable with the IV doctor in GDC's Pokemon Hospital. I implore you to use it as you need, especially in the upcoming price where the prices have gotten massively slashed.

 

Wait.. I forgot this was a think, where wwas it again?

[AceTrainerDevin]

4 minutes ago, Cyphre said:

 Again, im not advocating for a Crest nerf, im advocating for an opportunity for me to counter the entire field and use a different approach.

you can counter the entire field by just abusing it yourself with moves like hypnosis and other buffed moves you dont have to have the ability to remove the field to counter it and yes not everyone will be prepared for the battle on their first try but this mode is called intense for a reason you arent supposed to just steamroll everything  otherwise what would be the point of a hard mode you can have a different approach by changing around your evs and seeing how you can adapt instead of only relying on removing the opponents field

[Cyphre]

1 minute ago, AceTrainerDevin said:

you can counter the entire field by just abusing it yourself with moves like hypnosis and other buffed moves you dont have to have the ability to remove the field to counter it and yes not everyone will be prepared for the battle on their first try but this mode is called intense for a reason you arent supposed to just steamroll everything  otherwise what would be the point of a hard mode you can have a different approach by changing around your evs and seeing how you can adapt instead of only relying on removing the opponents field

And why manipulating Fields, which is a MAJOR mechanic in the game and is one of the advocated focal points of the entire experience, is a lesser option than abusing them? Why not give the player an option to either be prepared to directly abuse Haunted Field and counter Spiritomb, OR give him an option to be prepared by having a fitting team in the box that can change the field to YOUR advantage? I do not understand this advocating of "less options = better difficulty". It doesnt have to be a singular solution. I am a player that prefers counters and deflects in fighting games and i like to play chess with black, and in the same vein, as a human, in pokemon i much prefer ruining advantage of the opponent instead of abusing it myself to a higher degree. 

And now forced fields like Misty Terrain and moves as such dont even override existing Field, which was, again, another viable strategy to counter a spot in the fight you had troubles with before. (Which i understand now that Indeedee and such are in the game, but still). 

[bloww]

the game would be far too easy if you could change every field to one that directly counters the enemy team so i disagree completely with your idea of interconnected fields (see souta in v12 where you just needed a smack down and a dig to make him ridiculously easy. on a side note im not a big fan of how the change was handled because dig into cave field was a very fun strat to use on a lot of battles; i feel like making heavenly wing be able to change from cave to mountain in one use wouldve been a much more fair way to balance the fight, or maybe make it like the current geara field where you cant change into cave at all idk)

 

i do agree however that fields could use more changes, buffs or nerfs, in general considering there are over 40 of them and only a few of them get one or two minor changes every update

 

the early game really isnt as hard as you make it out to be, the lack of ev training really only sucks for narcissa where you have to ev train in speed to be able to counter her mismagius but the game isnt nearly hard enough to require 252 evs before the first gym. also very strong items like life orb are very very rare (im pretty sure the first use of life orb is on rens greninja before narcissa), assault vest isnt that bad, etc.

 

fairy tale field is busted so i cant really argue lol but you can also use it against melias team very easily

 

geara is an incredibly hard fight but its not unfair (unlike aegislash on fairy tale field for example). its more like g/z where you need to plan out your strategy a little more than the usual fights. plenty of mons can counter spiritomb, his team is very weak to status (hypnosis, will-o attack drop), etc. being able to change to blessed field really wouldnt help as itd be more like the angie gym fight where you can weaken a move once but then its back to the normal field

 

on the other hand, saki is basically the only fight in v13 that id call completely unfair. almost every way ive seen of beating her on intense require some mons and movesets that are WAY too specific (like, its still possible obviously but the time investment for this single fight compared to every other one is just too much) or just abuse counter/destiny bond, which i dont think is healthy at all. she doesnt really have a weakness outside of her abysmal speed which doesnt help much when her mons can tank all kinds of moves (even physical) and one shot everything that doesnt have sturdy or focus sash/band

[A¹¹]

After reading all of this I honestly say, what a shitshow. So I would like to explain a few things all of it seems too confusing, my apologies if I somehow end up being rude.

4 hours ago, Cyphre said:

4 hours ago, Paperblade said:

Her singular Steel type is then extremely soft to dark types, as it's a slow Ghost type.

Ah yes, that very slow extremely powerful boosted by a seed Shadow Sneak from Aegislash with precognition about when to use King's Shield and when not to. Understandable.

You know its still Shadow Sneak, it won't OHKO all neutral targets, also the AI is static and will always do the same thing, so you can simply predict the King's Shield and use for example Substitute or Bulk Up. Furthemore, you have been fighting Melia over and over for chapters now, its surprising that you can't manage her team.

And about Spiritomb, a regular Intense rotation usually consists of 9-20 members, if you don't have anything that can at least check Spiritomb then you might have some struggles with team building

Furthermore, I have seen a considerable amount of people doing Monotype runs or simply using the Pokemon they like and managing to beat the fight, even if with some struggle, so you are definitely not restricted to the same 5 Fairy Pokemon to beat it

1 minute ago, Cyphre said:

11 minutes ago, AceTrainerDevin said:

you can counter the entire field by just abusing it yourself with moves like hypnosis and other buffed moves you dont have to have the ability to remove the field to counter it and yes not everyone will be prepared for the battle on their first try but this mode is called intense for a reason you arent supposed to just steamroll everything  otherwise what would be the point of a hard mode you can have a different approach by changing around your evs and seeing how you can adapt instead of only relying on removing the opponents field

And why manipulating Fields, which is a MAJOR mechanic in the game and is one of the advocated focal points of the entire experience, is a lesser option than abusing them? Why not give the player an option to either be prepared to directly abuse Haunted Field and counter Spiritomb, OR give him an option to be prepared by having a fitting team in the box that can change the field to YOUR advantage? I do not understand this advocating of "less options = better difficulty". It doesnt have to be a singular solution. I am a player that prefers counters and deflects in fighting games and i like to play chess with black, and in the same vein, as a human, in pokemon i much prefer ruining advantage of the opponent instead of abusing it myself to a higher degree. 

And now forced fields like Misty Terrain and moves as such dont even override existing Field, which was, again, another viable strategy to counter a spot in the fight you had troubles with before. (Which i understand now that Indeedee and such are in the game, but still). 

You don't need to be manipulating fields, and you are in the same field as him and you have access to most of the things he have and more, fields are supposed to be a mechanic to make the battle more dynamic, not simply something that you need to kill like a cockroach. This is an equal fight on the same ground. Removing the field isn't a clever strategy, its just cheese because you put the AI in an extremely disadvantageous situation, that is one of the reasons the field overlay was implemented.

 

From what I can see you simply are ignoring any argument that defy your point, this is not a smart thing to do, you are just being toxic and childish, if you don't like the new Intense you might have fun in Normal with the improved AI, or simply learn from your mistakes to see how you can succeed on Intense, but please stop arguing, you are literally saying the same thing over and over, escaping any argument that might contradict what you said and flee to another, it would be healthier to simply admit that people can make mistakes.

This is not saying that either Intense or me are perfect, it definitely needs some changes and kinda agree that some fights need changes, I myself have complained about some things that made Intense less enjoyable, but always trying to give feedback in a positive way and being respecful, which has worked, things are definitely changing due to your comment and it will definitely have some repercussion which could definitely be controversial due to the many different opinions, from developers and players alike. It's ok to have opinions, but as I said before you should try a little better while arguing.

[Cyphre]

6 minutes ago, bloww said:

the early game really isnt as hard as you make it out to be

I never made out early game as very hard, i do think that pushing EV training cards after a later gym is a nonsensical desicion that only wastes a player's time without adding anything to the challenge. You are indeed not "required" to EV train until Narcissa, however a lot of people will still do it, it will just take much more time. 
 

2 minutes ago, A¹¹ said:

You know its still Shadow Sneak, it won't OHKO all neutral targets, also the AI is static and will always do the same thing, so you can simply predict the King's Shield and use for example Substitute or Bulk Up. Furthemore, you have been fighting Melia over and over for chapters now, its surprising that you can't manage her team.

You know it's still a 31 IV, 252 Atk EV, +1 from seed 150 base attack Aegislash? Of course it wont OHKO "everything", it's still not "just a Shadow Sneak". Furthermore, we havent been fighting Melia on a field that was custom build for her pretty much. 
 

6 minutes ago, A¹¹ said:

And about Spiritomb, a regular Intense rotation usually consists of 9-20 members, if you don't have anything that can at least check Spiritomb then you might have some struggles with team building

Maybe instead of being aggressive for no reason and trying to undermine other people, implying their "struggles with teambuilding", you could actually read the initial post and see that i fairly comfortably adapted and was able to build my team to defeat Geara and v13 trainers, but didnt find it enjoyable or well designed? 
 

9 minutes ago, A¹¹ said:

You don't need to be manipulating fields, and you are in the same field as him and you have access to most of the things he have and more, fields are supposed to be a mechanic to make the battle more dynamic, not simply something that you need to kill like a cockroach. This is an equal fight on the same ground. Removing the field isn't a clever strategy, its just cheese because you put the AI in an extremely disadvantageous situation, that is one of the reasons the field overlay was implemented.

And in my, i believe, absolutely valid opinion, there is also a way to design things not around making half of the fights a monotype Lollapalooza that will just abuse the Field. And you again had some struggles with understanding my point with that message. I dont NEED to be manipulating fields, yes. Claiming that changing Fields isnt a clever strategy is such a ridiculous claim i dont even know where to begin with this. Maybe Trick Room against faster teams is a cheap way to play now? Entry Hazards put enemy into a disadvantage, maybe forbid them too? 
 

15 minutes ago, A¹¹ said:

From what I can see you simply are ignoring any argument that defy your point

From what i can see you didnt try to understand or maybe even read my point and went all self righteous and aggressive into this, i believe, civilized discussion of conflicting opinions. 


I will defend my position, while people that disagree with me will defend their position. I believe this is how fruitful discussion should go and it will allow developers to see all sides of arguments and decide, what is a more fitting way to design their game. I am not insisting on anything and cannot and will not force them to do anything. As i claimed in the beginning, if this is how the game will decide to be, i will just do it on Normal next time and i fail to see a problem. So i would prefer for people to not go into personal "childish and toxic" attacks in this topic, if you want to say something personal, do it in the messages. 

[AceTrainerDevin]

11 minutes ago, Cyphre said:

Furthermore, we havent been fighting Melia on a field that was custom build for her pretty much. 

yes we have not fought melia on a field built for her before would be cool if that eventually happened though unless you are refering to fairy tale field but i doubt you are since that field has existed way before that melia fight and is just one of the fields rejuv took from reborn