Apology to BlueTowel and everyone associated with my mods (using them or playing them)

[Fervis]

Hello everyone.

As some of you already might know or heard, I had a confrontation with BlueTowel (creator of Plates of Arceus) because I have been using his assets early in development of rad reborn and eevee without consent since patch 18 and when bringing them over to patch 19 (PoA and Gen8 implementations).

 

First of all, I deeply apologize to Him and all people that are affected for doing that due to me being inexperienced in all that. Though, being a newbie is not an excuse for the mistake I made.

Secondly, there still seem to be some traces left that I most likely oversaw but are still in the code (even if not used). Therefore I will remove the mods for a certain time and go through every scripts files again, and consult Blue whether he is satisfied before uploading them again or not. This will definitely take a while so I am sorry for actually being this insensitive to a degree that you all are also affected by it.

 

Lastly, it was very imprudent of me to allow others using assets from my mod as basis for other projects without informing them to actually ask permission of the ones that are being credited for their respective work. Even though maxx’s mod only asked me for my eeveelutions, I did not actually consent in using my whole mod – but I also did not investigate any further if they were correctly used, so I am still involved.

 

Once more, I apologize to everyone, most importantly to BlueTowel.

If he is indeed consenting after I reviewed my mods at some point, I will upload them once again.

 

With this i will remove the download links for the associated time.

[BlueTowel]

12 hours ago, Fervis said:

As some of you already might know or heard, I had a confrontation with BlueTowel (creator of Plates of Arceus) because I have been using his assets early in development of rad reborn and eevee without consent since patch 18 and when bringing them over to patch 19 (PoA and Gen8 implementations).

Misleading. I haven't spoken to you since July last year.

After you used my work a second time without permission, while also removing credits, after I'd previously messaged you to politely ask you to ensure proper credit in both the thread and the download.

 

You did this in a hurry after I'd mentioned in chat that someone else was working on a vanilla gen 8 mod.
When I checked your code for the gen 8 mod, it was almost entirely from PoA (if via updating Radiation Reborn that was using PoA as a base and then removing the Uranium content) with what looked like vague attempts to hide usage of it. Even besides the code I personally did, I put a lot of work into assembling the graphics, data, etc. from various sources, and modifying some of them for bugfixes and to fit in Reborn, which you used as a base for your mods.

I didn't think I'd need to be too anal about crediting myself because I didn't think anyone would actually strip down the mod and try to pass it off as their own work in the same place without talking to me about it.

 

I told you to remove PoA-specific content from your mods at the time and warned you that your future actions would show if your apology for "accidentally" removing credits was sincere. Frankly, I didn't want to continue engaging with you on it while already being buried in other problems, and it didn't go unnoticed to me at the time that you didn't apologise for using my work without permission.

I later saw you admit that you'd barely played e19 before taking my work, and the person who was working on the vanilla gen 8 mod told me they were giving up because they didn't think anyone would want to play it, and I regretted not taking a harder line.

Compounded by the continued liberal use of my work and what seems like a pattern of misleading behaviour, I do not believe the sincerity of your previous apology, and so permission to continue using my work is revoked.

 

I'll admit to being mistaken over your gen 9 work. It sounded like you'd hastily imported the Essentials project regardless of whether or not things worked shortly after a reveal of a working implementation in PoA, but on closer inspection this does not appear to be the case. However, this work is redundant since I've been adding gen 9 directly to the new engine for all of the games and mods using it. This mistake also does not invalidate the previous issues regarding use of work without permission and removal of credits.

Stealing my work, undermining my work, and then continuing to piggyback off of my work in future without so much as an apology is not acceptable.

 

I hope your apology is genuine this time.

[Fervis]

I completely agree to your points. However, I certianly did not try to hide "any usage of your work". As you were generous to at least let me use direct Gen 8 implementations, I thought you meant respective implementations from your mod, thus incorrectly understanding your statement there.  Regarding the graphics and data as an example, I removed them and was in believe you meant those as PoA-specific files, not about your modifications on gen 8 scripts.

I also definitely did NOT do this on a whim after hearing someone is gonna do another Gen 8 mod. I was already at work when I became aware of this.

 

Credits indeed were given only after approach, however, since the start of the thread (which was now edited though), except for the text files attached to the download link, everywhere else I assured to let everyone joining the thread know that the basic foundation of the mod was built upon your extensive work. This of course does not justify my ignorance of credits in text-file format, but I want to clarify this point.  And I never said I "accidently" removed them, but rather was unaware of their importance to attach them in the download as well.

 

Still, I was definitely way too silent and inactive regarding direct confrontation and talking/asking about it. This was a good example to correct my behaviour in the future (even if it took multipls approaches).

Finally, I am incredibly grateful to you, introducing me into modding and I hope you understant that I had no malicious intent of the usage of your work (or even promoting them in any way).

I will be working on different mods then, and looking forward to the release of your mod for everyone enjoying additional content for reborn, which was ultimatley my sole reason to work on them myself.

[Ultimas Prime]

I know that this is a little weird that I am posting this here since I am an outsider and this is a personal matter, and I am sorry in advance for butting in but I think you both need to know something. From what I remember BlueTowel, Fervis did credit you for your mod and resources even at the very beginning. I downloaded the mod right after he released it around Christmas of last year and before I ever saw your mod, due to the timing in which I tried out reborn and even never hearing about your mod before at all, I knew that it was your assets that he used because he thanked you in his description that I read and even called the version at that time "an addition to the plates arceus mod". If you don't believe me you can read it on his page where he typed it on January 18th of last year in response to some one asking him about a nuclear plate. Anyone who actually read the comments on Radiation Reborn's page can see this because while the main post has been changed over the years the responses to posts have not and paint the truth very clearly. Now sure this accreditation was not engraved in gold in APA or MLA format, but I still knew that he was using your mod and that he did not create your mod. I thought y'all were just doing a collab, but from what y'all have posted it is kind of hard to tell. I even remember he had 2 versions we could download. The first was just the uranium mons that he added and 2nd was a copy of his gamefile that included your mod with a few others. Again for anyone who read the post it was very obvious it was just a copy of his gamefile with other mods others created preinstalled as he literally stated this. I don't mean to stir in anything but I just read this to try to figure out what all of the fuss was about, and I would love to hear from others who downloaded the mod at the same time to verify if they remember Fervis crediting Bluetowel by him literally saying his mod was and simply an addon to Bluetowel's mod.

 

Again, I know I don't know the whole story, and I don't want to make assumptions about anything as it is not wise to do so but I also know from making mods before that it is really easy to accidently use someone else's assets without even realizing it. So to me at least, it makes sense that he could have accidently left some of your assets in without realizing it. You see, I have made some horizon's gate mods in the past, and I once accidently added a plant from a farming mod some where in the map by accident because I thought it was a vanilla one. It is pretty easy to do when you are messing with a map editor in a game with mods installed instead of a coding engine (In case you were wondering that is a similar situation to which Fervis started modding his game as well as  he started with your mod as his foundation and he claiming his mod was merely and addon). Fortunately for me the author of the farming mod was very kind and understanding and he said I didn't have to deconstruct a map that was about the size of the whole game combined in order to find the few plants that I used of his. He said I did not even have to credit him because the plants he used were open access, but I credited him and the artist who created it and even linked his website where his/her art was located at, and in the end both of our mods became some the most popular mods for the game of that year with his getting more downloads than mine of course since his was now a framework which my mod now required. I guess what I am trying to say is that while it is true that a lot of people are trying to do wrong, it is not wise to assume everyone is.

 

No offense BlueTowel, but you are reminding me of nintendo right now when these are literally mods of pokemon fan games. I am more of a valve and skyrim era bethesda fan myself. Again, I do not know the whole story of the private messages given between you 2, but as a mod author myself of a another game I do not think that I would have responded the same way you did if someone treated my work the same way Fervis did your's. I don't know if you have noticed it, but even now he has done nothing but compliment you through all of these public posts. All of that being said, if I was Fervis I would try to make sure that not even a hint of BlueTowel's work was in my mod and then I would never work with him again and never go out of my way to speak with him. Both of your mods are great and I could only imagine how great it would be if they were combined again, but it is not worth it if it is causing y'all pain.

Edited January 22, 2023 by Ultimas Prime

[TrainGhidoran]

Thats why the first gen 9 mod is taken down? Really? Because of "no proper credits"? Thats sad. And I am very disappointed! Everyone knew that Fervis used codes from bluetowel. Credits were given and it was never a secret! The first and only gen 9 mod so far is taken down, even the uranium mod is down! A unique mod with Pokemon from Tandor and the nuclear type! I cant describe my disappointment right know. Its just sad.

[Bladeheart111x]

I mentioned this on Discord the day the mods were taken down, but good luck on rebuilding them!

[elixirmaster]

With BlueTowel effectively killing their account for health reasons, is there any change regarding the use of their assets for Radiation Reborn? I was wondering if they communicated any with you before they left...

 

 

 

Sorry if it's not appropriate to ask, I just really love your mod and PoA isn't going to be updated, so I don't see why there was beef.

[Dred]

1 hour ago, elixirmaster said:

With BlueTowel effectively killing their account for health reasons, is there any change regarding the use of their assets for Radiation Reborn? I was wondering if they communicated any with you before they left...

 

 

 

Sorry if it's not appropriate to ask, I just really love your mod and PoA isn't going to be updated, so I don't see why there was beef.

PoA assets are still to not be used without proper permission from Blue, and or the development team.

The PoA development team has plans to continue updating the mod, but is currently on hold. 

[Seraphicide]

After just finding out about all this and seeing this is the reason Radiation Reborn was taken down, after reporting multiple bugs on the RadReborn page to help create a fully functional crossover mod, it makes me sad that you guys couldn't come to some agreement. After Fervis acknowledged his wrongdoing and publicly gave what I felt was a very sincere and genuine apology over a dispute that was rooted in what boils down to a miscommunication or literal accident, and knowing that BlueTowel was credited to a degree, just not to the extent that they would have liked, it's very disappointing to say the least. I assume you're both adults and both enjoy creating content for the same fan game. Other than bruised ego, there is no reason after apologizing and talking through the problem that the two of you couldn't come to some level of understanding. To simply refuse his apology or to just say 'I hope it's genuine' just seems to display a lack of good faith imo, in a situation where Fervis has gone out of his way to try and be as diplomatic and accommodating as possible.

 

We're all here because we love Pokemon and Reborn, I would really like to see you guys work this out at some point. Many of us loved both mods, and this may be selfish of me to say but I don't think it's fair to everyone who enjoys both of your work that RadReborn just gets taken down over a dispute that imo should have been settled with a simple exchange like this.  "Oh shit my bad, I'm sorry I didn't clearly give you credit even though I never meant to blatantly steal or copy your work. How and where exactly do you want me to give you proper credit?" BlueTowel explains what they would like Fervis to do to make it right. "Sure man no problem, thanks for letting me use your assets as a base for my mod. I apologize if you felt slighted because of this misunderstanding. Won't happen again."

Then all is good in the community. I simply don't understand why his entire mod and all the work Fervis has done on Rad Reborn and All-Gen had to be taken down, and everyone who played his mods had to suffer over this. Here's to hoping you guys can work it out somehow. I wish you both the best in working on your mods and hope to see RadReborn back someday. Hopefully both parties learned something from this

[Valor Above All]

Mods should just close this thread like they did the PoA thread there is nothing productive going on in here and everyone just comes to give their own opinion on something already decided @Dred

[Dred]

Yep. please use your brain people. the work that blue made for the mod isn't owned by game-freak. his work was developed by him, and the PoA team, thus it falls under his ownership. 

Locked.