Timber Dragon Posted April 9, 2014 Share Posted April 9, 2014 A recent status update questioning the *cough* scenes in Shade's gym inspired me to take a peek through the game's data files, and I can confirm that, yes, Shade's creepy ass computer monitors show some serious foreshadowing. At first I wasn't sure whether the scenes were retrospective or if they predicted the future, but they do both. The monitors show Corey falling off the bridge, but it also Kiki's death via RAWRchomp. Then there's Titiana doing... something to Amaria (looks like she punched her off a building or something), and Lin's death via dismemberment. Ouch. This brings up some speculation on what will happen soon. If I recall, Amaria's team was in the 70s, and beating Luna raised the level cap to that point. I can imagine Amaria will be the next leader to face, or the one after--Hardy mentioned his gym was at Agate City, and once Ep 12 comes out, it's where we'll be going next. In any case, we'll probably be meeting up with Amaria soon, and Shade says it won't be pretty. As for Titiana, it was mentioned early on Florinia's Flobot-ness had something to do with her. What Titiana will later do to Amaria sheds some light on what that incident could have been. This also brings up interesting questions on who/what Shade is and his purpose. Why's he showing you that stuff? To creep you out? Probably; he's creepy in general. But he functions as something of a grim reaper, and Anna mentions he's nice. Him opening the Railnet gate could've been pushing his own mysterious agenda forward, but Anna has also been shown to see things no one else can (the player's "glowiness," the friendship strings on Shelly, etc), so we might have to take her word on it. Did Shade show you all that because he expects the protagonist to stop a tragedy? Is he a hero pulling some strings from the (har har) shadows? Was Kiki and Corey dying some sort of master plan of his necessary to lead to a happy ending? Or is it just his job as a mysterious entity? Who knows? But at least we got a badge from him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noivy Posted April 9, 2014 Share Posted April 9, 2014 Shade is more than what meets the causal eye. Lets just say he isn't malevolent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DashingStorm Posted April 9, 2014 Share Posted April 9, 2014 Spoiler alert much. Not that I haven't seen these scenes before, but still. To newer players, this will just be a "wtf was that" moment and they will continue the game to find out later on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vinny Posted April 9, 2014 Share Posted April 9, 2014 This is the truth... Shade is actually Amethyst, and that's a plot to kill us all But seriously... Shade show us the "past", and also the "future"... I mean, what he wants with that? I don't know... The only thing is, he showed you Corey, something that happened before his gym... And then, he shows you Kiki, "predicting" the future, and well... it happens... I don't know if i can simply assume that what he sowed you is going to happen... But rather, if you character don't do something, what he shows you MIGHT happen... But i don't know... Also, remember that there's one more PC = The one in the back, where the Rotom is... That's also very interesting... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pmegakid Posted April 9, 2014 Share Posted April 9, 2014 Shade could be the missing to why everybody say they know Lin from somewhere. To me Lin is not in control but she is a puppet for a bigger plan and since we now brainwashing is being use Lin could of been to maybe shes the sister mother or something. And shade is their father or the twins now I confuse myself lol can't wait to see what this story holds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timber Dragon Posted April 9, 2014 Author Share Posted April 9, 2014 Spoiler alert much. Not that I haven't seen these scenes before, but still. To newer players, this will just be a "wtf was that" moment and they will continue the game to find out later on. Well, I figured a title with "Spoils the Game" in it might clue readers in that it might contain a spoiler or two, like Kiki dies! Also, you don't get your bade from her! But honestly, aside from Corey, I didn't catch any of that until my second playthrough when I knew everything that happened, and I was all "Oh snap!" I hadn't understood the scenes in question the first time I saw them, let alone remember them when the prediction came true. All this was completely retrospective, having seen the bigger picture. This is the truth... Shade is actually Amethyst, and that's a plot to kill us all But seriously... Shade show us the "past", and also the "future"... I mean, what he wants with that? I don't know... The only thing is, he showed you Corey, something that happened before his gym... And then, he shows you Kiki, "predicting" the future, and well... it happens... I don't know if i can simply assume that what he sowed you is going to happen... But rather, if you character don't do something, what he shows you MIGHT happen... But i don't know... Also, remember that there's one more PC = The one in the back, where the Rotom is... That's also very interesting... Oh yeah, I forgot about the Rotom one. But I don't remember if it actually showed anything--I think it was just Rotom pulling a The Ring and popping from the screen. There's no guarantee the Amaria and Lin ones will happen, but considering what happened to Corey and Kiki, I'm leaning towards Shade knowing what he's talking about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vinny Posted April 9, 2014 Share Posted April 9, 2014 Oh yeah, I forgot about the Rotom one. But I don't remember if it actually showed anything--I think it was just Rotom pulling a The Ring and popping from the screen. On the last PC: Rotom shows Heather leaving Corey, and then he dies... It also shows someone related to Dr. Connal leaving, and... well... Rotom jumps out... The meaning of that? Honestly, i have no idea... It made me think about some stuff, but i can't guarantee anything... I'm not Amethyst... There's no guarantee the Amaria and Lin ones will happen, but considering what happened to Corey and Kiki, I'm leaning towards Shade knowing what he's talking about. May or may not happen, but i agree with this... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tempest Posted April 9, 2014 Share Posted April 9, 2014 Shade's involvement with the plot runs deeper than you think... He has somethings to do with Anna and Noel and the rest of them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mashonem Posted April 9, 2014 Share Posted April 9, 2014 The main thing to keep in mind is that when Shade's gym was first released, KiKi taking that massive L via Garchomp was still a prediction just like how something happening to Amaria and Lin going all Majin Vegeta are now. As it stands now, I'm leaning towards Shade's future telling abilities being pretty accurate. That said, there wasn't anything we could do to save KiKi, we simply weren't strong enough at the time. With the level cap at 70, we're pretty close to the level Amaria's Lapras was at when it was seen; we might be able to at least prevent Amaria from taking an L via Titania... or maybe the future is set in stone and Amaria's screwed regardless. Also, Titania's Pokemon might be pushing into the 80s; and I wouldn't put it past Ame to give Gym leaders the ability to get stronger either... Regardless, it doesn't look good for Amaria (or Titania with her judgement issues). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DashingStorm Posted April 9, 2014 Share Posted April 9, 2014 The future can only tell us so much. Up to us to find out what it holds in store for us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lost Lore Posted April 9, 2014 Share Posted April 9, 2014 Presumably, Shade could have been trying to warn the player of what is due to happen in the future, but as the future can't be seen with full clarity, there's no real way of knowing what actually will happen. Honestly, though, I don't think his intents are malicious in the slightest. He definitely still has some hand in the plot, though- I want an explanation to the fact that he was apparently the one who first told Luna to run away from home. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WanderoftheColossus Posted April 9, 2014 Share Posted April 9, 2014 I actually saved before every monitor to watch the scenes a few times. When i saw Corey fall I knew that the scenes on the monitor would be important. Then again I'm only playing through this once, I can't imagine having to recreate my team from scratch again, so I figured out Shade would be important throughout the story, also spoilers from the man giving the togepi egg also helped out since I did that before Shade's gym. So from what I've gathered, Shade is going to be extremely important Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GottaLoveShuckle Posted April 10, 2014 Share Posted April 10, 2014 (edited) I don't really see this as a spoiler but instead as good story telling. From the very start you know the villainous teams name is Team Meteor but we don't think anything of it even though it relates to their plans and what they are trying to reach. Later we learn team meteor blew up the grand stairway and all we know about why they did it is there is a power bellow Reborn they want to reach... Then later we learn about the fallen star (meteor) that Reborn was built above and all of a sudden we understand why they called themselves Team Meteor and what's the source of the power bellow Reborn and even with all this information we still don't know what they plan to do with this power. My point is seeing what you see in Shades Gym now doesn't really tell us much alone so it doesn't really spoil anything just like without other information Team Meteors name doesn't tell us they are looking for a meteor. Edited April 10, 2014 by GottaLoveShuckle Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Autumn Rain Posted April 10, 2014 Share Posted April 10, 2014 Err... what happens if you defeat that overpowered Garchomp? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vinny Posted April 10, 2014 Share Posted April 10, 2014 Err... what happens if you defeat that overpowered Garchomp? Solaris is like... "Hmm, i'm still cooler than you"... And then Kiki dies... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mashonem Posted April 10, 2014 Share Posted April 10, 2014 (edited) Err... what happens if you defeat that overpowered Garchomp? Solaris gets bored and calls it back. That's pretty much what it amounts to Presumably, Shade could have been trying to warn the player of what is due to happen in the future, but as the future can't be seen with full clarity, there's no real way of knowing what actually will happen. Honestly, though, I don't think his intents are malicious in the slightest. He definitely still has some hand in the plot, though- I want an explanation to the fact that he was apparently the one who first told Luna to run away from home. He's also apparently the one that recommended Noel become a gym leader. Edited April 10, 2014 by mashonem Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bear Posted April 10, 2014 Share Posted April 10, 2014 Been waiting for to talk about that rotom screen for ages. I suspect that it is luna with doctor connel which would answer the question of who her father is and how she got her gem. Connel seems completely unaware of the significance of the gems and i think he does suggest something about possibly having a daughter once.Honestly haven't played through the story in a while so I can't remember which parts are just forum rumours or odd details in script i've picked up. Back to Shade though he is the biggest mystery in this game and I don't even think we should expect an explanation about him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magus Posted April 10, 2014 Share Posted April 10, 2014 I got respect for Shade, cleaning up the dead is a dirty job, but someone has to do it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lost Lore Posted April 10, 2014 Share Posted April 10, 2014 (edited) Err... what happens if you defeat that overpowered Garchomp? You get some slightly different text in a certain event somewhere. Otherwise, yeah, you still basically lose. He's also apparently the one that recommended Noel become a gym leader. ...Yeah, I know. I wasn't 100% sure that that's what the Investigation Squad meant, but that was my best guess. But that is... interesting, too. Been waiting for to talk about that rotom screen for ages. I suspect that it is luna with doctor connel which would answer the question of who her father is and how she got her gem. Connel seems completely unaware of the significance of the gems and i think he does suggest something about possibly having a daughter once.Honestly haven't played through the story in a while so I can't remember which parts are just forum rumours or odd details in script i've picked up. Back to Shade though he is the biggest mystery in this game and I don't even think we should expect an explanation about him. ...I am actually 90% certain that that is not Luna, but instead Sigmund's sister, Elizabeth. Whose grave is suspiciously in Beryl Ward's cemetery, I might add... along with a few others with familiar surnames. Edited April 10, 2014 by Lost Lore Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chase Posted May 1, 2014 Share Posted May 1, 2014 The farthest I have gotten on a Reborn run is Shade's gym, but before playing Reborn, I watched what felt like hours of shofu's and nickaboo92's playthoughs on youtube to understand what I was going to be up against. After being creeped out by poor Amy getting "worked over" and some chick (who eventually became Kiki, which caused a second round of heebie-jeebies when shofu reached Apophyll.) getting her soul snatched by a (eventually Solaris') Garchomp, I realised that Shade had -some- sort of foresight. After mulling the situation at hand, there are five monitors, but only two of them have featured PAST events. And, regardless if Solaris handed you some Pokedollars for being a total badass or if his Garchomp caused Cain and Victoria to be amazed at your expense, we have to confirm that both events DID happen just as the monitor revealed. Shade's batting 1.000. Obviousness aside, the thing that is truly fun to think about is......why does any of these tragedies matter to the player character? If Shade was going for fear factor, imagine what he did to spook Fern... *All Monitors display Fern losing to the Player Character, with the last one revealing the player character entering the Reborn Hall of Fame after defeating the Champion.* Back to seriousness, is it -indeed- possible that Shade is trying to forwarn the player of events that -will- happen? or is he trying to set the player up for becoming an interloper to those events? My thoery so far - is this. The player character witnesses Corey release his Pokemon on Beryl Bridge before jumping off to his death in the Lapis Ward. The player character also witnesses Kiki's beheading (and the even more tragic end of her Medicham via molten lava.)....Perhaps, Shade is indicating that the player's presence in Reborn is somewhat related to the deaths -past AND future- on the screens? One of those who die is Lin, the leader of Team Meteor. We already know we as players are antagonist forces to Team Meteor. We end up being the reason Lin explodes after putting down their schemes for good. This theory isn't new to Pokemon if you buy into theories such as Giovanni's death by waterfall in the Tohjo Falls after beating him in the Celebi event. Amy's death is the only outlier....but judging from the player's encounter with assailant Titania (I think) in the North Adventurine Woods, perhaps the player is known as an ally to Amaria, and Titania has a disliking to the player that is so strong she would kill her fellow schoolmate. It's also been mentioned that Amaria has the sapphire key though. Man, Speculation is fun! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Veterans Azeria Posted May 2, 2014 Veterans Share Posted May 2, 2014 The farthest I have gotten on a Reborn run is Shade's gym, but before playing Reborn, I watched what felt like hours of shofu's and nickaboo92's playthoughs on youtube to understand what I was going to be up against. After being creeped out by poor Amy getting "worked over" and some chick (who eventually became Kiki, which caused a second round of heebie-jeebies when shofu reached Apophyll.) getting her soul snatched by a (eventually Solaris') Garchomp, I realised that Shade had -some- sort of foresight. After mulling the situation at hand, there are five monitors, but only two of them have featured PAST events. And, regardless if Solaris handed you some Pokedollars for being a total badass or if his Garchomp caused Cain and Victoria to be amazed at your expense, we have to confirm that both events DID happen just as the monitor revealed. Shade's batting 1.000. Obviousness aside, the thing that is truly fun to think about is......why does any of these tragedies matter to the player character? If Shade was going for fear factor, imagine what he did to spook Fern... *All Monitors display Fern losing to the Player Character, with the last one revealing the player character entering the Reborn Hall of Fame after defeating the Champion.* Back to seriousness, is it -indeed- possible that Shade is trying to forwarn the player of events that -will- happen? or is he trying to set the player up for becoming an interloper to those events? My thoery so far - is this. The player character witnesses Corey release his Pokemon on Beryl Bridge before jumping off to his death in the Lapis Ward. The player character also witnesses Kiki's beheading (and the even more tragic end of her Medicham via molten lava.)....Perhaps, Shade is indicating that the player's presence in Reborn is somewhat related to the deaths -past AND future- on the screens? One of those who die is Lin, the leader of Team Meteor. We already know we as players are antagonist forces to Team Meteor. We end up being the reason Lin explodes after putting down their schemes for good. This theory isn't new to Pokemon if you buy into theories such as Giovanni's death by waterfall in the Tohjo Falls after beating him in the Celebi event. Amy's death is the only outlier....but judging from the player's encounter with assailant Titania (I think) in the North Adventurine Woods, perhaps the player is known as an ally to Amaria, and Titania has a disliking to the player that is so strong she would kill her fellow schoolmate. It's also been mentioned that Amaria has the sapphire key though. Man, Speculation is fun! Damn i knew that this game was dark but now ........ huhuhuh But i just want to say that the fact that Lin is confirmed to have been one of the people in the orphanage being a bully to Laura It also mean there is somebody else monitoring the strings behind the scenes because there is no way a 12 year old would be allowed to lead an evil team Maybe shade has something to do wih this ^^ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HolyKnight Posted May 2, 2014 Share Posted May 2, 2014 Maybe Shade is the true boss of Team Meteor and he´s playing whit everybody. Just Kidding. But i agree that they are future events of what´s up next, i really hope they are. And whit the doctor, i think it may means that the girl who run away is her daughter or wife who pass down, something that Mirror´s Corey and Heather event. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tacos Posted May 3, 2014 Share Posted May 3, 2014 Never have I felt so riddled by a character who is brought up so subordinately, but metaphorically is one of the most important characters in the game. Obviously, Shade controls all, knows all, and seems to be quite trusted among certain characters. My thought is that he is not one soul, but every soul there is to come. Past, present and future. Being made up of every single soul would allow him to know what is yet to come and what has happened before. Also, perhaps he can morph into a trusted person to each character so he can change the outcome of people's lives. Considering he has had an influence on Anna and Noel, perhaps he was able to morph into their father to convince them. Perhaps, he is the one who holds all the keys, and gifted them to those trusted. For example, he could have posed as Anna's father when she received the Amethyst Pendant. Perhaps because the protagonist of the game is of unknown origin and no link to any human life, we do not see him as a singular soul, but as a collection, the entity we know him to be. The only thing I struggle with understanding, is if Luna was convinced by him to abandon Elias, then who was he morphed as to convince her to leave? I'm thinking along the line of maybe Gossip Gardevoir, or maybe even Radomus. Maybe, she had a mother who she was aware of that had once passed, and Shade had morphed into her to influence her decision. I'm sure that my theory is incorrect, considering the fact that because there aren't many answers to Shade's identity, Ame can morph him freely to what she desires, but regardless, it's my thoughts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chase Posted May 3, 2014 Share Posted May 3, 2014 Never have I felt so riddled by a character who is brought up so subordinately, but metaphorically is one of the most important characters in the game. Obviously, Shade controls all, knows all, and seems to be quite trusted among certain characters. My thought is that he is not one soul, but every soul there is to come. Past, present and future. Being made up of every single soul would allow him to know what is yet to come and what has happened before. Also, perhaps he can morph into a trusted person to each character so he can change the outcome of people's lives. Considering he has had an influence on Anna and Noel, perhaps he was able to morph into their father to convince them. Perhaps, he is the one who holds all the keys, and gifted them to those trusted. For example, he could have posed as Anna's father when she received the Amethyst Pendant. Perhaps because the protagonist of the game is of unknown origin and no link to any human life, we do not see him as a singular soul, but as a collection, the entity we know him to be. The only thing I struggle with understanding, is if Luna was convinced by him to abandon Elias, then who was he morphed as to convince her to leave? I'm thinking along the line of maybe Gossip Gardevoir, or maybe even Radomus. Maybe, she had a mother who she was aware of that had once passed, and Shade had morphed into her to influence her decision. I'm sure that my theory is incorrect, considering the fact that because there aren't many answers to Shade's identity, Ame can morph him freely to what she desires, but regardless, it's my thoughts. That's an interesting thought! There's one person who knows about Shade (in the context of the game, under the circumstances of your theory) as the player character sees him. Shelly. Shelly poses a question to Anna about what kind of entity Shadow is in a genuinely concerned manner. The thing about Anna though, is that we already know, due to the implications of Schizophrenia, that she sees people differently (such as the player characters, comprised of dark colors in their spriting, being "glowy" or that Shelly has various strings, indicating that she has various people caring for her.) Perhaps an entity like Shade WOULD seem like a generally appealing character to her. You also bring up Luna. Luna has a certain affinity for "darkness" that is unrivaled by anyone else in the game, and seeing as Shade is an entity shrouded in darkness to the player character, it's also quite possible that Shade doesn't have to "shapeshift" or "morph" for her either, because Luna typically sees no issue in darkness. I don't mean to say that it's -impossible- for Shade to morph or change alias, but he didn't have to for certain to appear before the player and Shelly, and judging from the details of Anna and Luna, he wouldn't "have" to morph for them to get whatever he was trying to say. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Foamy Posted May 3, 2014 Share Posted May 3, 2014 (edited) The thing about Anna though, is that we already know, due to the implications of Schizophrenia, that she sees people differently (such as the player characters, comprised of dark colors in their spriting, being "glowy" or that Shelly has various strings, indicating that she has various people caring for her.) Perhaps an entity like Shade WOULD seem like a generally appealing character to her. Anna's not schizophrenic. She's psychic! She senses and sees things related to people's personalities, minds, and emotions. For instance, she repeatedly talks about burn scars on Charlotte's face, even though the other characters can confirm that she has nothing of the sort. What Anna is actually seeing are the scars on Charlotte's psyche. Ever since her parents perished in the house fire, Charlotte has been harboring a deep regret for accidentally causing the fire, which is reflected in the burn scars that Anna sees. Edited May 3, 2014 by Foamy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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